Hilary Russo: How safe do you feel in?
Jessica Baum: your relationships.
Hilary Russo: And let me stress that by safe I don't necessarily mean healthy.
Hilary Russo: It could mean familiar.
Hilary Russo: It can mean that you're so used to it that it feels comfortable, even if it's uncomfortable, and this is something that many people face, right, I know I've been there.
Hilary Russo: I was in a toxic relationship that I stayed in far longer than I needed to or should have, because it felt familiar, and that uncertainty of being alone is a lot scarier than lonely with something new.
Hilary Russo: And something new could actually mean spending more time with yourself, being safe in your own skin and with who you are and by yourself.
Hilary Russo: Many people feel this pain, and it could come from childhood trauma.
Hilary Russo: It could come from being in a relationship that you had that was not positive, and now you're bringing that into your new relationship.
Hilary Russo: But how do we nip that in the bud?
Hilary Russo: And you know, on the show on HIListically Speaking, I bring the best of the best when it comes to experts in their field, and that is why Jessica Baum is joining us.
Hilary Russo: She is a licensed psychotherapist.
Hilary Russo: She is a bestselling author of Anxiously Attached Becoming More Secure in your Life and Love, and now she has a new book coming out specifically focusing on safe.
Hilary Russo: In fact, that's the title of the book Safe, focusing on safe.
Hilary Russo: In fact, that's the title of the book Safe Coming home to yourself and others an attachment, informed guide to building secure relationships.
Jessica Baum: Jessica, we can never talk about this topic enough, and I'm so glad you're here, I'm so excited to be here and, yes, it is such an important topic and a complex topic and one that we all need a lot of information on, because we all desire those safe relationships.
Hilary Russo: You know we have a lot of areas we can go into when we do this work in therapy and different kinds of approaches to helping people on their emotional well-being journey.
Hilary Russo: What was your reason for focusing on relationships?
Jessica Baum: And I know you have the Relationship Institute in Palm Beach, florida- but what was your why for wanting to go into that area and really design your business around that?
Jessica Baum: You know, I think that I mean I'm an imago therapist, which is a couples counselor, and I've worked in addiction and with codependency.
Jessica Baum: But when I learned attachment theory and when I mean really studied attachment theory, it explained a lot of my suffering, like I.
Jessica Baum: You know, the word codependency doesn't really mean anything to me anymore because I understand attachment theory on like a neurobiological level and I think, personally and professionally and what I see in the world is so many of us struggle with attachment issues, you know insecurities, adaptations, patterns, and when I really understood how many people are suffering in the way that I had when I was younger, before I did some deeper work, I just I like people, I just knew people needed this information.
Jessica Baum: I just it just filled in the gap for so many people and so, yeah, it was just, it was huge.
Jessica Baum: For me, attachment is everything and when we have healthy, secure attachments in our lives, we like literally thrive, but if we don't, our lives are literally miserable.
Jessica Baum: So really understanding and like what you said in your intro, like we stay in the familiar for a lot of reasons.
Jessica Baum: And I spent a lot of time unpacking that compassionately in this book like there are deep psychological and implicit reasons as to why we stay in what we know and want to resolve our trauma, often in situations that only perpetuate and recreate it.
Hilary Russo: Yeah, beautifully said.
Hilary Russo: You really hit the nail on the head when you titled this book safe.
Hilary Russo: You really hit the nail on the head when you titled this book safe, because it is something that I that a lot of people struggle with and maybe they don't know it's safety.
Hilary Russo: You know that beautiful amygdala of ours is designed to go to the negative anyway to keep us safe.
Hilary Russo: They say that the whole idea of it's not you, it's your brain, it's doing what it's designed to do, say that the whole idea of it's not you, it's your brain, it's doing what it's designed to do, but in that it impacts your entire body, this somatic side of your body, the emotional side of your body, the autonomic side of your body and the cognitive side.
Hilary Russo: So where can we stress to people that are tuning in that the idea of safety is possible?
Jessica Baum: Yeah, I mean listen, that the idea of safety is possible.
Jessica Baum: Yeah, I mean, listen, the interesting thing about safety is we can't fake, fake safety, Right, and it starts actually with safe relationships with others and those safe relationships allowing you to be present with what's going on inside of you and you know I think you know, we can think that a relationship is safe.
Jessica Baum: It can start out feeling very safe and then, you know, our wounds come up and our patterns come up and things can start to feel really unsafe if we're really unconscious in those relationships and we don't get conscious as to what is really being awakened inside of us.
Jessica Baum: So yeah, healing starts in safe relationships.
Jessica Baum: I'm a firm believer that it can happen in romantic relationships, but it does take two people willing to get conscious about what's really going on inside them to create a container of safety, to evolve.
Jessica Baum: Or it takes another safe relationship I call them anchors in our lives to help hold what we're holding in our body.
Jessica Baum: So a lot of the book is about you know the body keeps the score.
Jessica Baum: It's about how we're holding attachment wounds in our body and the science around that.
Jessica Baum: It's not woo-woo Like I actually unpacked the science around implicit memory and stored memory and attachment wounds in the body, and we need safe people to start to even understand what that is.
Hilary Russo: So are there certain steps that you do go through in this book to make it easy for people to understand, especially when you're in it?
Hilary Russo: It's very hard to see how to change anything when you're actually in the upset.
Hilary Russo: You know when you're in the duress.
Hilary Russo: So if someone is listening and tuning in and we have an amazing, amazing listenership here and I just want to give people options or if they know somebody, what would be the first thing that this book could be beneficial to give them like a companion guide?
Jessica Baum: Oh yeah, I mean, the book does so much and it would be hard for me to like kind of narrow it down.
Jessica Baum: But it talks about what type of relationships actually heal us.
Jessica Baum: From a scientific level it talks about implicit memory.
Jessica Baum: So it talks about how to start to notice what is going on in the here and now and through sensations, and what our original memory system is, how to connect that to the original wound.
Jessica Baum: So hopefully, when you read the book you get a guide and it comes with somatic meditations that I give you, even separately.
Jessica Baum: But you come out realizing that that feeling in your gut or that feeling in your heart or the way your muscles are feeling, have more to do than what's just happening in the here and now, and that your body is holding on to attachment stories and attachment memories.
Jessica Baum: And so we start to create like awareness around what is going on inside of you.
Jessica Baum: We developed something called interoception in the book, which is the ability to kind of really tune into the body and really start listening to your body and develop a new relationship with your body.
Jessica Baum: It's not a weekend read, it's a companion one that I hope you bring to your anchors or your body.
Jessica Baum: It's not a weekend read.
Jessica Baum: It's a companion one that I hope you bring to your anchors or your therapist, like it is teaching you to kind of really become conscious of what might be going on inside of you, so that you don't keep repeating the same quote, unquote, trauma bond and automatic nervous system cycles that you might get stuck in, which can make you miserable as you know.
Jessica Baum: Yeah.
Hilary Russo: And you mentioned anchors.
Hilary Russo: For those who aren't familiar with that, what exactly is an anchor?
Jessica Baum: So I study interpersonal neurobiology and in the practice and the philosophy that I study is that you can't heal unless you have healing relationships.
Jessica Baum: And so what was wounded early in relationship can only heal in relationship.
Jessica Baum: So we need to re-experience things in a healing relationship.
Jessica Baum: It doesn't mean that has to be a therapist.
Jessica Baum: I actually in the book, unpack what types of relationships are healing, because not everybody can afford a therapist.
Jessica Baum: But an anchor is someone who holds space in a state of safety, for the most part right.
Jessica Baum: No one is always in a state of safety or ventral, listens, is empathic towards you and allows you to share.
Jessica Baum: And in the sharing you kind of dive deep into what's going on in your inner world.
Jessica Baum: And I say that in order to build inner security we internalize anchors.
Jessica Baum: So we have to internalize safe people.
Jessica Baum: The same way an infant internalizes their parents.
Jessica Baum: The parents are secure, they internalize that.
Jessica Baum: As adults we get to re-internalize people again.
Jessica Baum: So we use our anchors and we use supportive relationships as a way to re-anchor into security.
Jessica Baum: That's just one of the methods but a big theme in the book.
Jessica Baum: But what if?
Hilary Russo: people don't feel any of that.
Hilary Russo: What if people are struggling?
Hilary Russo: And I imagine there's people listening right now that are like I don't have that.
Hilary Russo: I don't have a person I can talk to.
Hilary Russo: I don't feel like it's a safe place to talk to my partner, I don't think my friends are going to get it, or my family?
Hilary Russo: Where do you start with something like that?
Hilary Russo: I mean, obviously the first step is an awareness that something doesn't feel right in your body and your mind.
Hilary Russo: So that's good.
Hilary Russo: If you're feeling that you're tuning in and listening and saying you're pulling against that resistance, that's a good first step.
Hilary Russo: But what do you do with that once you know that?
Jessica Baum: Yeah, I mean it's such an important question that you're asking because people come to me all the time.
Jessica Baum: Nick, I don't you're my safest person, you're the only one, and so sometimes you can find it in a room.
Jessica Baum: Sometimes it's the aunt that you like and I talk about in the book how to kind of go through your Rolodex and see if there's anyone with the capacity.
Jessica Baum: But I also want to let you know that in my experience, and what your nervous system starts to recognize is, it only takes one safe relationship to get vulnerable and have that experience for your nervous system to start to understand that that's what you want and crave and and I'm not a manifester, but our nervous systems will call in what we are experiencing.
Jessica Baum: So if we can experience this with one person, one relationship can change the trajectory of your, of your healing process.
Jessica Baum: So I'm not going to sit here and say you can do this on your own.
Jessica Baum: There's parts that you can do on your own when it comes to healing.
Jessica Baum: But we do need each other and I and I and I.
Jessica Baum: I think it's important to say that because I don't want people to go home and read a self-help book and think they're going to heal their attachment wounds.
Jessica Baum: All by themselves, right, that's like setting you up for failure.
Jessica Baum: But I mean, and I have clients that are like I've been doing session with you, jess, and now I have a different level of intimacy or a different level of understanding, and now I'm looking for that and my nervous system starting to recognize that as more familiar or safe and I'm orienting to that.
Jessica Baum: So it only takes one relationship to really start to change the blueprint.
Jessica Baum: But we do need to find secure, healthy people to internalize and to start to do the work, and so that is a necessary component person that they didn't even think about or you know, someone they've lost touch with that does have a capacity to listen and really does care and look at you as a whole person or doesn't judge you or try to fix you.
Jessica Baum: So after you start doing a little bit of the work and if not, you know there are therapists and coaches that hopefully can hold non-judgmental space and start to create the safety for you, and many people have to start that way as well, especially in our culture.
Hilary Russo: Yeah.
Hilary Russo: So let's just emphasize that it only takes one.
Hilary Russo: Just remember that it only takes one and, like you said, like Jessica said, go through that Rolodex.
Hilary Russo: Think about people who have been in your life, people who might've come back into your life, people you've lost touch with, because, really, we all have a story.
Hilary Russo: We're all living on this big blue marble and trying to get through and make it a positive experience.
Hilary Russo: Don't think for a moment that everyone's life is perfect.
Hilary Russo: Right, there's always somebody and something happening In this digital age.
Hilary Russo: We see the best of the best online, but we're always we're not seeing the battles that people are facing all the time, you know.
Jessica Baum: And you'd be surprised I I in the book, I give you so much knowledge.
Jessica Baum: I called co.
Jessica Baum: I talk about co-anchors and if you're listening you're like I don't have someone like that.
Jessica Baum: There are 10 other people that are saying I don't have someone like that.
Jessica Baum: And it just takes a little vulnerability and courage and I give the instructions as how you can co-anchor each other.
Jessica Baum: It's like, basically, co-regulation at its best.
Jessica Baum: So sometimes what we do is we develop listening partnerships or we find people like that.
Jessica Baum: We're not so dysregulated in our life.
Jessica Baum: I can hold space for you and then you can hold space for me and we start to build these deeper containers with each other.
Jessica Baum: So there are other people that are thinking just like you and it's like the scariest first step is finding some one person that you feel safe enough with.
Hilary Russo: Yeah, Great, it's really about community.
Hilary Russo: When we think about it, the word community is so important.
Hilary Russo: We see people leading group coaching or just going out and having a group of sisters or friends or people that you're just meeting, that you can share with.
Hilary Russo: You know it can make a big difference just being heard and knowing you're not alone in the battle.
Hilary Russo: So, yeah, really important.
Hilary Russo: That's the first step to safety.
Hilary Russo: With that being said, I just want to mention to folks safe coming home to yourself and others, and attachment, informed guide to building secure relationships.
Hilary Russo: Little thumbs up came up.
Hilary Russo: These apps always have the all.
Hilary Russo: At least it's a thumbs up right If you're tuning in or watching on YouTube.
Hilary Russo: But this book is not your first.
Hilary Russo: You had another book that came out, the Anxiously Attached.
Hilary Russo: How do they differ?
Hilary Russo: How?
Jessica Baum: do these books differ?
Jessica Baum: Anxiously Attached focuses on anxious attachment.
Jessica Baum: Everyone loves Anxiously Attached.
Jessica Baum: It's a great starter.
Jessica Baum: It talks about the anxious avoidance dance a lot.
Jessica Baum: It talks about building inner security.
Jessica Baum: A lot about the abandonment wound.
Jessica Baum: Safe talks about all attachment styles and all wounds and that we never are really just one.
Jessica Baum: We can show up in different relationships.
Jessica Baum: And safe dives deep into the science of healing.
Jessica Baum: So it's not just about attachment but it's about understanding the attachment wounds from the inside out what it's like to be a baby, what these patterns feel like, what our parents are going through.
Jessica Baum: But SAFE talks about the neural net.
Jessica Baum: It literally talks about how the healing process unfolds from a neurobiological level.
Jessica Baum: Because I want people to have the science.
Jessica Baum: I don't want this to just be like a book.
Jessica Baum: Do this.
Jessica Baum: I want you to say okay, and I'm in this healing process and this is what's happening.
Jessica Baum: My neural nets are opening.
Jessica Baum: My response flexibility.
Jessica Baum: Time is changing.
Jessica Baum: This is what this wound feels like.
Jessica Baum: This is where you know.
Jessica Baum: It's a more.
Jessica Baum: It's a deeper dive into attachment theory.
Jessica Baum: And it's for everyone, because, even though I identify as anxiously attached, I actually feel very secure in my life now and I've done a lot of work since the first book, I have avoidant protectors.
Jessica Baum: I had disorganized pockets in my life.
Jessica Baum: So I talk about how, even if we can feel like we identify with one attachment style, we actually are never rarely just one and we have different embedded responses in different relationships and I really I paint the whole picture for you.
Jessica Baum: So you're going to, you're going to walk away with a much deeper understanding of attachment.
Hilary Russo: Here's what I love as well as a therapist and this is something I think has changed in the world of therapy and emotional wellbeing is that therapists are becoming more real.
Hilary Russo: And I've got stuff too Right.
Hilary Russo: So when you share that, I think it and I've got stuff too right.
Hilary Russo: So when you share that, I think it creates more of a human realism.
Hilary Russo: You know Jessica's been through stuff, you know Hilary's been through stuff and we're all just humans walking each other home here.
Hilary Russo: So just being able to understand what your attachment style is and that you had to do the work yourself makes you a better therapist, makes you a better human being a better woman.
Hilary Russo: So these are the important things and these are the kind of therapists and practitioners that I love talking to, because if you've been through it, you're going to understand it more.
Hilary Russo: It doesn't mean you have to be through the same battle or the same upset, but just knowing that nobody's life is perfect.
Hilary Russo: This is how we grow and learn, you know.
Jessica Baum: Yeah, I so appreciate that when I wrote Anxiously Attached, I was doing a lot of deep work with my current partner, who decided that he didn't want to do the deep work at a certain point, which was devastating for me, you know, especially for someone in my position, and losing him brought up all my abandonment wounds again and I talked really openly about that.
Jessica Baum: It was a very humbling experience and you're absolutely right, like I had pockets of disorganization, I had deep wounds to heal and it was like, just because I'm an expert and I study, I wish that would bypass the work, but it doesn't and I'm not embarrassed to share it because I just really want.
Jessica Baum: I want to help people and yeah, I'm human too and I got to walk the walk and we don't know what that is sometimes when we're walking into it, but with the right support we can just keep going.
Jessica Baum: We can keep going through it Great.
Hilary Russo: Thanks for sharing that so beautiful, and I totally resonate with that myself, because when you're going through it, you don't see it, you don't know how to get out of it.
Hilary Russo: It almost feels like you are at the bottom of the ocean and you cannot find a way to pull yourself up.
Hilary Russo: When you're at the bottom of the barrel and being able to do the work and learn through it and just having some tools even if you're in the work yourself can also have that feeling of imposter syndrome can come up because you're like I should know better, I shouldn't have been in a relationship like this.
Hilary Russo: I remember feeling that way, but for those of you who might feel that as well because that can come up like I'm an established person or I've built an empire or I'm a great mom and how did this happen to me?
Hilary Russo: I'm a good person that feeling of what did I do comes up, like what did I do wrong, and that can be very heavy, you know.
Jessica Baum: Yeah, I really talk about implicit attraction.
Jessica Baum: So I talk about like what maybe the listener will want to term as like unconscious, but it's really not unconscious.
Jessica Baum: But we're attracted to particular people for a variety of reasons, like physical attributes, pheromones, but the long term trajectory of a relationship comes down to implicit information in our body and what we expect from relationship.
Jessica Baum: I deeply unpack that because I, you know, I loved my ex-partner and he had a lot of traits that were similar to my father growing up, and I talk about it, and the work that I did was to get conscious of my original wound, and so it was a portal in.
Jessica Baum: I wish he would have done the work with me.
Jessica Baum: I mean, I think we all wish that.
Jessica Baum: I think he wishes that too.
Jessica Baum: But the work is hard and you can't force another person to do the work.
Jessica Baum: Although in my book I talk about many couples do do the work together.
Jessica Baum: So many people are, you know, lucky enough to get conscious, but you know it's it takes a certain kind of person to be able to walk through that fire.
Jessica Baum: So I just think that we are attracted to what we know and leaning on safe people and doing the work is usually the unfamiliar and and it feels scary and hard and, if you're listening, like a listening partner.
Jessica Baum: But that is actually how we start to reorient towards a whole new way of being, and so we want to try to not go to what we know and start to form relationships that feel different to our nervous system, safer, so that we can reprogram ourselves I hate that word but re-experience new ways of relating that become healthier, and they become the new benchmarks to moving forward into healthier romantic partnerships.
Jessica Baum: I mean that's where I go into family dynamics.
Jessica Baum: In this book it's not just romance but like let's face it, like romance is where a lot of our implicit or our trauma kind of gets recreated.
Hilary Russo: Right, I love that you're using the word re-experience.
Hilary Russo: I like that better too, than reprogramming, because it sounds more human than a computer, which a lot of times we hear the analogies like this is like an operating system.
Hilary Russo: You know it is, but we're humans, so re-experiencing.
Hilary Russo: We all want good experiences and that's a beautiful way of putting it.
Hilary Russo: So just to remind you this book Safe Coming Home to Yourself and Others, an attachment, informed guide to building secure relationships.
Hilary Russo: I'm going to have this available on the podcast platform on HIListically Speaking.
Hilary Russo: But also, don't forget, we have the HIListically Speaking book nook and my authors who have been on this show.
Hilary Russo: The books will be there for you, so I will have the book.
Hilary Russo: I will have the HIListically Speaking Book Nook and my authors who have been on this show.
Hilary Russo: The books will be there for you, so I will have the book.
Hilary Russo: I will have the information on Jessica available for you to get in touch with her and learn more about her programs and the book.
Hilary Russo: So, stress not, it will be there for you to help you be safe.
Hilary Russo: So I'm for your.
Jessica Baum: I have something special.
Hilary Russo: Oh, please share yes.
Jessica Baum: I have a blueprint on attachment labels deeper so a deeper dive.
Jessica Baum: So they can get that immediately.
Jessica Baum: And I have a recording of me and my mentor, who's in her eighties, who's has studied this stuff forever, talking about inner security and what that feels like.
Jessica Baum: So for those of your listeners who buy it, we'll give you the link.
Jessica Baum: They will get those special free offers with it, so it'll give them a jumpstart.
Jessica Baum: Love that.
Hilary Russo: Love that so much so we'll actually add that to the podcast as well.
Hilary Russo: So everything's available for folks to grab the book.
Hilary Russo: Amazing, that's a beautiful offer, and hearing the mentorship.
Jessica Baum: How was that for you?
Jessica Baum: Listen, I just feel like you know, certain people come into your life.
Jessica Baum: I, this woman, came into my life helping me edit my first book, and her name's Bonnie Bannanock, and she has studied interpersonal neurobiology for like over 20 years, to the point where I, even if I studied every day, I could never register the amount of information and compassion that she held.
Jessica Baum: And from the moment I met her, I was just like I just need more of this.
Jessica Baum: What is this?
Jessica Baum: And it was the wisdom and it was safety and it was neurobiology, and she just became my mentor.
Jessica Baum: She helped me find a therapist.
Jessica Baum: She has single-handedly changed my life.
Jessica Baum: I am so incredibly grateful and you know, and so just listening to her and I just get so much wisdom from her and so many people follow her.
Jessica Baum: She's she's written the heart of trauma.
Jessica Baum: She's the therapist that therapists go to for learning.
Jessica Baum: So she's um, she I've been just so lucky to have the right, safe support come into my life and help me kind of create this book.
Jessica Baum: So she's been a, she's been a big part of it.
Jessica Baum: I'm just very grateful.
Hilary Russo: So, listen, we're going to put that in the book nook.
Hilary Russo: We have more information that you can find in the notes of this podcast.
Hilary Russo: If this conversation touch, moves and inspires you in any way, if anything that Jessica is sharing or that I said is something that you feel will resonate with somebody else, could help someone else or even yourself, like, go a little deeper, consider paying it forward, passing it along, you know, leave a comment or a rating review so that we know that this is making a difference.
Hilary Russo: It'll allow more ears and eyes to get on this episode and this conversation and touch more people, because that's really what it's about.
Hilary Russo: It's about community, it's about making a difference in the world, it's about serving others, isn't it?
Jessica Baum: Absolutely, and if you're listening and you're struggling in your relationship and you're just like, here I am again, I just want you to know you are so not alone and you know.
Jessica Baum: I hope this information gets to you so you can put some of the pieces together.
Jessica Baum: And yeah, I just.
Jessica Baum: I just want people to not feel alone Like we are.
Jessica Baum: We are in this together.
Jessica Baum: We're all trying to help each other out here.
Hilary Russo: Beautiful.
Hilary Russo: What are you hoping will come from this book?
Jessica Baum: I hope that people who are interested in attachment theory there's a lot out there will see this as very innovative in a new way and I think it paints compassion for even narcissistic wounds.
Jessica Baum: It paints such a compassionate lens for how we get wounded and how that plays out in our life and what we attract that I just, I hope it just, enlightens the reader.
Jessica Baum: I hope the reader, I hope every reader walks away somewhat shifted or creating some insight in their life that you know impacts them.
Hilary Russo: Yeah, beautiful.
Hilary Russo: All right, that's the heavy stuff we're getting out of the way.
Hilary Russo: Let's have a little fun.
Hilary Russo: I want to have a little fun with you, so I do a thing on this show that I've been doing for years, called the brain candy game.
Hilary Russo: This is basically a rapid fire game, so we're going to put the neurons to work.
Hilary Russo: I'm going to throw out a word that you said during this episode, and what I want you to do, miss Jessica, is come back with the first word that comes to mind.
Hilary Russo: Have a little fun here, have a little fun.
Hilary Russo: Okay, here we go.
Hilary Russo: You ready, all right, anchors.
Jessica Baum: Special people.
Hilary Russo: Relationship.
Jessica Baum: So important Somatic.
Hilary Russo: Everything.
Hilary Russo: Interoception A skill Rolodex.
Jessica Baum: I hope you have many, that's great.
Hilary Russo: Healing Great.
Jessica Baum: Healing Hard work and worth it.
Hilary Russo: Trauma Sucks.
Jessica Baum: Mentorship, lucky Attachment, everything.
Hilary Russo: Wounds, love, awareness, important Re-experience, gift, safe, everything.
Hilary Russo: Yeah, it is everything Amazing.
Hilary Russo: You were good at that.
Jessica Baum: Those are a lot of words I'm very familiar with.
Hilary Russo: I know.
Hilary Russo: But you know, the difficulty is like we internalize it and we want to the right word and we'll sit there and we ruminate on it.
Hilary Russo: I've had that happen.
Hilary Russo: And then I have people that are just like boom, boom, boom, boom.
Hilary Russo: You knew where you're going with each one of those things, which, to me, says you truly align and you resonate with everything that you're doing in this book.
Hilary Russo: But it goes beyond the book.
Jessica Baum: With the first book it's like I didn't realize how much more healing I had to do.
Jessica Baum: But I feel and I'm always healing there's no finish line.
Jessica Baum: But I feel like I'm embodied in a way that I can walk.
Jessica Baum: I can walk into the world with this book and be like I have lived this experience and I want you to have that too, and I feel very proud about that.
Jessica Baum: I mean, that's harder than the book itself.
Jessica Baum: You know?
Hilary Russo: Yeah, definitely.
Hilary Russo: Thank you so much, Jessica.
Hilary Russo: This has been great.
Hilary Russo: I want to give you a moment just to share some final thoughts.
Hilary Russo: Even though you have shared some wisdom bombs here, what would you like to leave with those who are tuning into HIListically Speaking?
Jessica Baum: If you decide to get curious about your own patterns and you know creating healthier relationships, just know that you're taking a very courageous step and it's okay to admit that you know we have we have tough relationships or that we're suffering in our relationships and that so many people are experiencing that that look perfect on the outside and it's just not what's going on.
Jessica Baum: You're just not alone.
Jessica Baum: If you're in that situation and I just I hope you get what you need and you feel supported in the way that you can.
Hilary Russo: All right, my friends, it's time to feel safe, and you can do that by connecting with Jessica and also picking up a copy of her latest book Safe Coming Home to Yourself and Others an attachment-informed guide to building secure relationships.
Hilary Russo: You know this book is going to be right up there on the HIListically Speaking Book Nook Library, so you can grab it there.
Hilary Russo: You can also find it in the notes of this podcast, in addition to that beautiful gift that she's giving away if you purchase this book.
Hilary Russo: It can't be any better than that.
Hilary Russo: And once you finish once you finish this conversation, I would be so grateful if you could give it some love, leave a thoughtful response or rating.
Hilary Russo: Wherever you are tuning in and watching it could be on Apple or Spotify, or even on YouTube or anywhere you're tuning in.
Hilary Russo: Your comments help this conversation reach more people, and that's really what it's all about, isn't it?
Hilary Russo: It's about community and you're part of the process, and I thank you for it.
Hilary Russo: And don't forget, you can always join me live, every month online for the free, havening happy hours.
Hilary Russo: This is my gift to you.
Hilary Russo: I've been doing it since March of 2020, and I don't plan to stop.
Hilary Russo: It's a safe place to learn how to put the power of emotional wellbeing and healing in your hands, with neuroscience on your side.
Hilary Russo: And if you are already a fan of Havening and you've been in my Havening happy hours or we've worked together, you've seen me on stage and you're looking to level up and bring Havening into your practice, you can get certified and I can help you do that.
Hilary Russo: And I added more information about you becoming a pioneer practitioner and what you can do to work with me in mentorship.
Hilary Russo: I'd love to have you.
Hilary Russo: So the music for this show of HIListically Speaking since day one has been created and produced by Lipbone Redding.
Hilary Russo: Give him a listen.
Hilary Russo: It's music for your soul and without you, my friend, without you tuning in week after week, this wouldn't all be possible.
Hilary Russo: Thanks for trusting me, thanks for joining me on this journey, and remember this, this journey, and remember this.
Hilary Russo: All you need is one anchor right Trust that you have the ability to be safe, and it begins with taking that first step and choosing to hug it out with yourself.
Hilary Russo: I'm glad you're here, I love you, I believe in you and I'm sending hugs your way.
Hilary Russo: Be well.