1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:01,920 >>Kevin Patton: Diversity Officer   2 00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:09,680 Rachel Olivero once stated, "Inclusion  is not bringing people into what already   3 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:17,906 exists. It is making a new space  a better space for everyone." 4 00:00:17,906 --> 00:00:19,920 >>Aileen Park: Welcome to The A&P Professor,   5 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,800 a few minutes to focus on teaching  human anatomy and physiology with   6 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:29,960 a veteran educator and teaching  mentor, your host, Kevin Patton. 7 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:32,080 >>Kevin Patton:  8 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:48,760 In episode 151, we chat with some of the folks  behind the new Accommodations Handbook from HAPS.  9 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:55,000 Well, I'm really excited about having this  conversation today with my three guests who I'll   10 00:00:55,000 --> 00:01:00,760 introduce to you in just a moment because this is  regarding a topic that is really dear to me. Over   11 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:09,200 the course of my teaching career, I've run into  issues with accommodations for students and I   12 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:16,160 didn't really find a lot of good resources to use,  but HAPS, The Human Anatomy & Physiology Society   13 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:24,880 has just released a new resource. It's the Anatomy  & Physiology Student Accommodations Handbook. If   14 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:30,840 you want to kind of follow along during this  conversation, it is out there and available   15 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:41,040 on the HAPS website. Just go to hapsweb.org,  that's H-A-P-S-W-E-B.org, and look around for   16 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:47,920 the resources, especially the member resources. Now, you're going to have to log in at that   17 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:55,760 website before you're going to be able to download  and browse through this resource. But if that's   18 00:01:55,760 --> 00:02:00,120 handy to you right now while you're listening,  that may not be a bad idea. You can always   19 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:04,800 go back and refer to it anytime you want  though. Just go to the HAPS website,   20 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:10,680 log in, and it should be easy to find. HAPS  is in the process of updating the website,   21 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:18,280 so I hesitate to give you any specific directions,  but it's easy. Believe me, it's easy to get to it.  22 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:25,960 Okay, so let's meet our guest for this chat.  First we have Jennifer Ann Stokes, PhD who's an   23 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:33,360 Assistant Professor of Kinesiology at Southwestern  University in Georgetown, Texas. She's been a   24 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:40,640 HAPS member since 2020 and she is chair of the  Accommodations Subcommittee and that's within   25 00:02:40,640 --> 00:02:46,600 the Curriculum & Instruction Committee. By the  way, the Curriculum & Instruction Committee,   26 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:51,880 those of us in the know always call it the C&I  Committee. So when we start talking about C&I,   27 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:57,280 you'll know what that is, Curriculum &  Instruction. And she's also the Interim Chair   28 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:05,982 of the HAPS Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion, DEI  Committee. So Jennifer, welcome to our podcast. 29 00:03:05,982 --> 00:03:07,705 >>Jennifer Stokes: Hello. Thanks, Kevin. 30 00:03:07,705 --> 00:03:10,720 >>Kevin Patton: And along with Jennifer, we have Rachel Hopp,   31 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:18,640 PhD. She's Associate Professor in Biology at the  University of Louisville in Louisville, Kentucky,   32 00:03:18,640 --> 00:03:25,920 and she's been a HAPS member since 2006. She's  also on the HAPS board, and not only is she on the   33 00:03:25,920 --> 00:03:33,480 board, but she's the upcoming president. She's the  president-elect. As of July 1st of this year, she   34 00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:40,560 is the president-elect, so she'll be stepping into  the hot seat sooner than she realizes. And then   35 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:45,960 besides that, she has quite a background on the  board. She's been the Southern Regional Director   36 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:52,520 of the HAPS board two different times, once  in 2015 to 17, and another time, well actually   37 00:03:52,520 --> 00:04:01,720 continuing on to 2019. She's also been the chair.  She's the recently stepping down chair of the HAPS   38 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:08,266 Curriculum & Instruction Committee, the C&I  Committee. So Rachel, welcome to the podcast. 39 00:04:08,266 --> 00:04:10,585 >>Rachel Hopp: Hey, Kevin. Thank you for having us. 40 00:04:10,585 --> 00:04:13,560 >>Kevin Patton: And then we have Abbey   41 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:20,200 Breckling, MS. She's a lecturer in anatomy  and cell biology at the College of Medicine,   42 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:26,920 the University of Illinois at Chicago, and  she's been a HAPS member since 2018. And she   43 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:33,680 is currently the chair of the C&I Committee  and she's also chair of the Lab Resource   44 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:40,542 Subcommittee within the Anatomical Donor  Stewardship Committee. Welcome to you Abbey. 45 00:04:40,542 --> 00:04:42,785 >>Abbey Breckling: Hi, Kevin. Thanks for having us today. 46 00:04:42,785 --> 00:04:44,160 >>Kevin Patton: Okay. So like I say,   47 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:49,280 I'm really looking forward to this. I already  said what we're going to talk about and that's   48 00:04:49,280 --> 00:04:55,160 this Student Accommodations Handbook. The  name kind of says what we need to know,   49 00:04:55,160 --> 00:05:02,480 but it's long, and so there's more than just,  well, what about accommodations? And so what is   50 00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:08,582 the purpose of this project and this handbook?  Jennifer, you want to start us off with that? 51 00:05:08,582 --> 00:05:12,000 >>Jennifer Stokes: Absolutely Kevin, thank you. So like you said,   52 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:16,440 yes, the handbook is a bit long, but there  is a lot of really good information in it,   53 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:22,680 and the overall goal of this handbook is to assist  instructors in meeting student accommodation   54 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:27,960 really by identifying meaningful alternatives to  existing protocols. So things we kind of standard   55 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:34,520 do in the lab for anatomy and physiology. So  all of these suggestions come from HAPS members,   56 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:39,320 professionals that are actively involved in  providing accommodations to students and really   57 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:45,200 focused on best practices supported by current  research and the concepts of universal design.   58 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:50,000 The goal and kind of our intention with this  handbook and all these suggestions that are here   59 00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:56,560 is to make anatomy and physiology laboratories  really as inclusive and accessible as possible,   60 00:05:56,560 --> 00:06:02,225 allowing all learners, really all of our students  to achieve their desired level of success. 61 00:06:02,225 --> 00:06:03,920 >>Kevin Patton: Something that I picked up on in what   62 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:11,120 you said in my browsing through the handbook is,  and just to clarify for everybody, well actually   63 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:19,600 just to clarify for me, that's what's important  here, and that is this is mainly aiming at lab   64 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:25,422 accommodations as opposed to what you would  do in lecture. Am I seeing that correctly? 65 00:06:25,422 --> 00:06:26,720 >>Jennifer Stokes: Yeah, I think that's correct,   66 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:31,240 Kevin. Although a lot of what we talk about in  the handbook, particularly around the concept of   67 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:36,280 universal design could be extrapolated or  also brought into potentially the lecture   68 00:06:36,280 --> 00:06:41,520 class or if maybe you use a pretty active learning  environment in your lecture class, you might find   69 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:48,920 some of these tools and suggestions helpful. But  we do focus also a lot on a laboratory-specific   70 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:53,680 activity such as dissection or things that  are really only going to happen in the lab,   71 00:06:53,680 --> 00:06:58,920 maybe the use of microscopes, stuff like that. But  depending on the type of classroom that you run,   72 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:04,560 you might also find these suggestions really  helpful and not even just your A&P lab course,   73 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:08,825 but maybe the lecture class or other  courses that you teach as well. 74 00:07:08,825 --> 00:07:12,000 >>Kevin Patton: I'm glad you explained that because I was kind   75 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:20,000 of thinking to myself that maybe the de-emphasis  of the lecture courses because there already are   76 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:25,680 a lot of resources out there these days, much  more so than when I first ran into accommodations   77 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:33,800 issues. There's a lot of resources out there for  a traditional lecture-type situation, but you make   78 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:40,960 the point that depending on how you teach your  lecture, there could be some stuff you're doing,   79 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:47,920 activities. We do more and more active learning  these days it seems. And so there could be   80 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:53,120 different kinds of things that are really kind  of like a lab-oriented sort of thing, but we're   81 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:59,440 doing it in the lecture course, so we could find  some help for those things in this handbook too. 82 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:01,720 >>Rachel Hopp: And I'll just add in there,   83 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:06,520 Kevin, if you don't mind, that the  only thing that was out there that   84 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:12,240 was kind of close to the scope of what we were  looking to achieve was the American Chemical   85 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:19,440 Society had a handbook similar to what we've  generated, and it was very chemistry-oriented,   86 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:24,905 and we had a very different lab setting, and so  that was part of the impetus for the project. 87 00:08:24,905 --> 00:08:26,920 >>Kevin Patton: Yeah, I really appreciate,   88 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:33,880 well, I think that's true of all of the  HAPS resources, and that is one of the   89 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:40,840 really cool things about them all is that they  really hit me where I'm at in my teaching. So   90 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:47,960 if I'm teaching A&P, or A or P, then I  know that these resources are going to   91 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:54,360 have things in it that I don't have to adapt  somehow and figure out how am I going to do   92 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:59,960 this. That was a great idea to jump off of  that platform in chemistry and say, well,   93 00:08:59,960 --> 00:09:06,160 here's how we can do things in A&P. Thanks for  that clarification, Rachel. Jennifer, was there   94 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:10,862 anything else you wanted to say about the purpose  of this before we move on to another topic? 95 00:09:10,862 --> 00:09:13,080 >>Jennifer Stokes: I do also want to highlight   96 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:17,480 that really with the concepts of universal design  and the different things that we talk about in the   97 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:22,760 handbook, one of the goals as well is to produce  an equitable environment for all learners to help   98 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:27,760 with these different accommodation requests. So  faculty are often familiar with accommodation   99 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:32,720 requests, but in terms of how to meet those  in an equitable way and to really support   100 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:38,305 student learning and success, maybe there's some  suggestions here that people will find helpful. 101 00:09:38,305 --> 00:09:39,760 >>Kevin Patton: Yeah. Just to throw in a   102 00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:46,920 little example of my long and as yet incomplete  journey in trying to be more inclusive for my   103 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:54,560 students. Early in my career in my A&P course,  I had a student who was pretty good in my class   104 00:09:54,560 --> 00:10:02,400 and he always sat right in front and seemed very  enthusiastic and asked good questions and so on.   105 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:09,000 At the end of A&P two, we had our final exam and  he was the last person to turn in his exam, so it   106 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:14,840 was just me and him in the classroom. And he came  up and he thanked me for a course that I already   107 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:22,720 knew that he found interesting, and he says, "I  am probably going to end up with a B." He said,   108 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:28,120 "But I think I could have easily gotten an A if I  could have heard everything you said." And I said,   109 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:34,120 what? And he said, "Yeah, I'm hard of hearing  and you don't realize it but probably,   110 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:40,560 but you turn around and face the whiteboard  and the screen a lot when you're talking."  111 00:10:40,560 --> 00:10:46,520 And he said, "Even when you're walking around in  the classroom, you'll face in one direction, but   112 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:53,920 you're not facing where I'm sitting all the time."  And I just, oh, my heart sank because I thought   113 00:10:53,920 --> 00:11:00,480 this is somebody who was not always included  yet was an enthusiastic and hardworking student   114 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:06,680 who could have done better, although B is pretty  good. He could have done a little bit better had   115 00:11:06,680 --> 00:11:13,240 I paid more attention to being inclusive. And so  having a resource like this that's going to kind   116 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:19,800 of wake me up to some of those ideas. Now that  one I'm already awakened to, but to wake us up   117 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:27,200 to some things that we can be doing to include  all our students. This is a wonderful thing.   118 00:11:27,200 --> 00:11:34,360 Let's move over to Rachel, who having been chair  of the C&I Committee for so long, and that has   119 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:40,360 a good overview of the history of this. You kind  of gave us a hint there with the chemistry stuff. 120 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:42,160 >>Rachel Hopp: Yeah. 121 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:46,306 >>Kevin Patton: How did this get started and how did it develop? 122 00:11:46,306 --> 00:11:48,760 >>Rachel Hopp: Well, like most things in HAPS,   123 00:11:48,760 --> 00:11:54,880 it happens because of conversations  between HAPS members. And so I was   124 00:11:54,880 --> 00:12:02,440 on the board my second term, and Elizabeth  Hodgson-Shearer was another board member,   125 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:06,880 and we were just having these side conversations  about what we were seeing on the HAPS Listserv,   126 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:13,280 that people were getting accommodation requests  and they didn't quite know what to do or what was   127 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:20,400 reasonable or what suggestions, what they should  do. And so we were seeing this and we're like,   128 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:24,320 wow, we don't really know how to answer  all of this. And then there would be,   129 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:29,560 of course, in the HAPS Listserv, there are  people that chime in with great responses.  130 00:12:29,560 --> 00:12:36,360 And I can remember that Barbara Heard was one  of them, and she wrote some really interesting   131 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:40,920 remarks to somebody. I think she said something  to somebody. I'll just read it. This is back in   132 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:46,040 2017. "There need to be standards regarding  the accommodations that are provided to   133 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:50,640 students with disabilities in the science  laboratory, instructors and DSS," which is   134 00:12:50,640 --> 00:12:57,320 one of the many abbreviations for disability or  accommodations type office personnel. "They need   135 00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:02,920 evidence-based research in order to make informed  decisions regarding the accommodations that are   136 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:08,640 provided to students with disabilities." And then she goes on to talk about how the   137 00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:14,600 accommodation services personnel, sometimes they  don't know the best way to work in our spaces in   138 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:21,000 anatomy and physiology. Sometimes the instructors  don't know. And so there's just kind of this need   139 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:30,640 to have resources. And so anyway, that's where we  were in 2017. And in 2019 when I stepped off the   140 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:38,080 board, I had some passion for C&I and they asked  me to be the C&I chair at that time. And I said,   141 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:44,920 "Okay." And I thought I was going to get a break,  but I decided, yes, I am pretty passionate about   142 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:52,680 the C&I, the curriculum and instruction topic.  And so I agreed to chair that committee and I   143 00:13:52,680 --> 00:14:00,840 had three subcommittees in mind to get some things  accomplished, and one of them was accommodations.  144 00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:07,160 And Abbey who I could see was really passionate  about the topic too. And I said, "Do you want to   145 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:14,080 be the subcommittee chair?" And she agreed  and she might comment later on about that,   146 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:22,960 but we just started talking and this was 2019  and we had other people that were interested.   147 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:29,400 We got Barbara Heard from the Listserv, and I'd  like to put her website in the show notes for   148 00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:33,880 you because I think she's got a lot of resources  there as well in addition to the handbook that   149 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:39,720 we have. And so she was on the subcommittee  and there were a bunch of other people that,   150 00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:45,560 I'm not going to name all of them, but they were  just willing to meet in 2019. And we were just   151 00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:51,040 thinking about different ideas and we're like,  well, maybe we should do a survey because we don't   152 00:14:51,040 --> 00:14:57,920 know every accommodation request that's out there  and maybe we need to hear more from HAPS members.  153 00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:03,080 And so we started creating this survey and it was  gargantuan big and it had too many questions and   154 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:10,680 it was just going to be difficult to use all that  information. And so we kind of stepped back and we   155 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:16,360 decided, well, maybe that's not the way it's going  to go. And then of course, the shutdown happened   156 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:23,400 in 2020 and most labs were not meeting in person.  And so we thought really the direction of the   157 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:29,160 handbook, which was going to be lab oriented  all the time, we'll just take a pause. And   158 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:39,600 so we didn't work on the topic for a year. And  then in late 2021, as labs were going hybrid,   159 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:44,520 we decided, well, we really need to reinvigorate  this. People still get these accommodation   160 00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:51,360 letters. There's still quite a need. And so  we started thinking that our webinars in HAPS,   161 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:58,320 which we call town halls, were really bringing in  pretty big audiences of interested HAPS members.  162 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:09,280 And so we decided we would do a town hall series  in January of 2022, and we picked that time period   163 00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:14,280 because we wanted instructors to have that  information at the beginning of their semester   164 00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:19,280 because that's when they usually get those letters  of accommodation. And so that meant the committee   165 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:26,840 was doing a lot of work at the end of 2021,  which is instructors doing their final exams   166 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:33,640 and holiday times and break and all this. And I  couldn't believe how excited our committee members   167 00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:39,440 were and how dedicated they were to have these  meetings in their December where they could have   168 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:47,000 really probably taken a break. And so they put  together this town hall series and it was awesome,   169 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:54,680 and it was a way for us to share what we had  learned, but really get a lot of feedback from   170 00:16:54,680 --> 00:17:01,960 members in HAPS and questions and so forth. And so  those town halls are still on the HAPS website if   171 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:07,520 you want to go back and look at that information. And so we gleaned a lot of information from the   172 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:15,000 town hall and through the next couple of  years doing some posters and workshops,   173 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:22,720 gathered more information and really decided we  wanted a written document to have all of this   174 00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:29,120 together so that an instructor that gets a letter  of accommodation can then see that there are   175 00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:36,560 multiple suggestions for how they might be able  to meet that accommodation. And so it was like we   176 00:17:36,560 --> 00:17:42,920 never intended to have a one size fits all  scenario. Your letter says this and you're   177 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:48,360 supposed to do that. It was never supposed to be  like that because we knew that there's a lot of   178 00:17:48,360 --> 00:17:55,200 nuanced issues with institutions having different  resources and different laws in different states   179 00:17:55,200 --> 00:18:03,440 and so on. And so we wanted this handbook to  really have a lot of various suggestions for   180 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:09,360 our instructors. So anyway, I'm very proud of  the work that Abbey and that Jennifer and the   181 00:18:09,360 --> 00:18:16,800 whole committee have put into this document. And  I was looking at it this morning and just kind of   182 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:23,865 breezing through the sections. It's like 62 pages  long and just thinking, wow, this is amazing. 183 00:18:23,865 --> 00:18:25,040 >>Kevin Patton: It sounds amazing.   184 00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:32,680 It makes me tired hearing all the work that went  into this. That's, congratulations to everybody   185 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:40,000 who is involved because that's work that helps  support all the rest of us. That's work that we   186 00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:46,760 as individual members of HAPS don't need to do  ourselves because you guys did that. So kudos   187 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:56,360 to all of you for doing that. And I was aware  of this project going on and understood when it   188 00:18:56,360 --> 00:19:02,360 came out. At the recent HAPS conference we had  in St. Louis, I got to learn a little bit more   189 00:19:02,360 --> 00:19:08,400 about it and I knew there was some work involved.  I mean, there always is in these sorts of things,   190 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:15,040 but I appreciate Rachel, you kind of laying  out that there were many different aspects of   191 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:22,520 how this developed and how the resources were  envisioned and then put together. So that's   192 00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:33,840 super. I'll be back with Jennifer Stokes, Abbey  Breckling, and Rachel Hopp in just a minute.  193 00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:39,520 I've been hearing more and more from people in  the anatomy and physiology teaching community that   194 00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:47,800 they're leaving the X platform, formerly known as  Twitter for a variety of reasons. That's not too   195 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:57,560 surprising given the several controversies related  to X. but it's also not surprising because well   196 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:06,160 change. Yeah, change happens all the time.  And in the world of social media and internet   197 00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:13,000 communication, the pace of change feels like it's  accelerating. If you're one of those who have   198 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:20,200 taken flight from X or currently in the process of  flying the coop, then you may be checking out the   199 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:29,160 BlueSky social platform. Did you know that The A&P  Professor is active in BlueSky? Why not follow us   200 00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:38,782 there by searching for The A&P Professor? There's  a link in the show notes for this episode too. 201 00:20:38,782 --> 00:20:40,880 >>Abbey Breckling: I'd like to just kind of   202 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:49,440 toot Rachel's horn, that she really got all of  this started and we wouldn't have been able to   203 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:56,160 even publish onto the HAPS web without her and  her really great initiatives. But in any case,   204 00:20:56,880 --> 00:21:04,320 our committee was phenomenal in getting all of  this written down and reviewed. But one thing   205 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:11,040 that I do want to highlight is that we really took  the time to get outside reviewers, not just in the   206 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:18,000 town halls and the posters. That was a really  crucial moment, but we even had a posting on   207 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:24,120 the Listserv and we basically said, hey, if  you're an expert in any one of these areas,   208 00:21:24,120 --> 00:21:29,760 we'd really love for you to come and review  these sections. And so I think that that's a   209 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:35,600 really crucial part to highlight because it wasn't  just our committee members who put together these   210 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:42,560 suggestions. These really came from multiple  HAPS members and even outside institutions.  211 00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:49,560 I know I sent the handbook when it was in its  review process even to my own disability office at   212 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:56,120 my own institution, and they also gave another set  of eyes and reviewed that as well. So it really is   213 00:21:56,120 --> 00:22:02,760 this huge compilation of, I would say probably  40 to 50 people who have looked at this document   214 00:22:02,760 --> 00:22:09,200 and reviewed it and has given it into its final  stages now. So I'm also very proud of everyone   215 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:13,720 who's worked on this, and I don't think I can  say thank you enough for everyone who's put in   216 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:19,906 the time and effort to kind of get this to this  final stage here of publication on the HAPS web. 217 00:22:19,906 --> 00:22:21,680 >>Rachel Hopp: I would like to add to that Abbey   218 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:28,520 and toot Abbey's horn because she's been great  on this. And I also want to say a big thank you   219 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:34,040 to Jennifer Stokes for leading the tremendous  work of doing the final editing, reviewing,   220 00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:40,200 revising, and formatting of the handbook. We  appreciate her leadership in coordinating not   221 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:46,520 only the subcommittee of writers, but also all  the necessary interactions with our external   222 00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:52,840 reviewers during that process. There were so many  people involved, as we've kind of alluded to. The   223 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:58,240 full list of contributing subcommittee members  will be in the show notes and we definitely   224 00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:05,280 want to acknowledge their work for the handbook. Yes, cross-pollination with the diversity equity   225 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:14,400 and inclusion committee on this and really worked  on those inclusivity issues, but also from this   226 00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:20,640 committee we're able to advise even the conference  committee because there have been issues at one   227 00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:28,560 of the HAPS conferences with people with being  able to hear the speaker or visually the room one   228 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:34,400 time had a lot of ambient light, and so  it kind of made it hard to see the screen   229 00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:40,280 if there wasn't a lot of contrast. And so even  out of this committee, we made recommendations   230 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:46,262 to the HAPS conference committee about some  things, and that was really with Abbey's help. 231 00:23:46,262 --> 00:23:46,920 >>Abbey Breckling: Kevin, that kind of   232 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:51,440 goes back to your student interaction,  right, about talking or looking at the   233 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:58,440 whiteboard when talking. It's just a simple  quick fix. Walk around with a portable mic,   234 00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:03,320 but sometimes we don't even know that that's an  option or you don't know that you actually need   235 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:08,385 another suggestion or other suggestions  to kind of help you in those situations. 236 00:24:08,385 --> 00:24:08,960 >>Kevin Patton: Well, yeah,   237 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:16,240 that's a great point because part of the solution  to that I guess was for me to really start to be   238 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:22,600 more conscious of where I'm facing. The more  conscious we get of those sorts of things,   239 00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:28,600 the more we can take actual steps. And back then,  I mean that's all I thought I could do is just   240 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:33,480 pay more attention to where I'm facing  because not everyone, I know that,   241 00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:40,640 and maybe we can get into this a little bit later,  there are different rules and requirements and   242 00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:48,440 so on for people who have a documented need for  accommodation. But I think that a lot of people,   243 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:54,480 maybe everyone has some little thing somewhere  that they struggle with in a classroom and they're   244 00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:59,960 not going to say anything because they don't want  to cause trouble. They don't want to be annoying,   245 00:24:59,960 --> 00:25:06,000 they don't want to be a burden on anyone. And yet I think we as instructors are   246 00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:12,520 becoming more and more aware of such  issues and hopefully are becoming,   247 00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:21,000 maybe developing their empathy in cases like that,  in taking some extra steps to make sure everything   248 00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:31,280 is accessible. And we need the resources, we  need advice on how to do that. So I guess Abbey   249 00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:41,760 turning to you. Here's this big book. It's not,  okay. I was going to say it's not something you   250 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,920 want to just sit down and read through, but  I kind of did. I didn't really read, read it,   251 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:52,840 I just kind of skimmed through it. So it's not  really probably meant for that. How do I, as   252 00:25:53,400 --> 00:26:02,902 an A&P instructor, what are some ways that I can  use this thing for my own little individual world? 253 00:26:02,902 --> 00:26:03,960 >>Abbey Breckling: Yeah, thanks for that   254 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:10,880 question. I think when we look or download  this document and see the 62-page length,   255 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:18,720 it's extremely intimidating to look at a document  that large. So I first want to say that we were   256 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:25,000 very intentional about the way that this handbook  was organized. And so we actually had a lot of   257 00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:32,160 back and forth conversation about what titles  do we use for each section, how do we go about   258 00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:38,560 the planning and then the writing within each  section. And so what it really came down to was   259 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:46,440 that this handbook was going to be for instructors  who received letters of accommodation. And so how   260 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:55,040 this handbook is then organized is that we sort  of, I guess if you will, polled common letters of   261 00:26:55,040 --> 00:27:01,360 accommodation occurrences that you would actually  get on a letter, that an instructor would get.  262 00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:13,160 So for instance, extended time or distraction  reduced environments, or specifically receiving   263 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:19,960 a leave of absence. So those are some  things or some instances or topics I guess,   264 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:26,160 that you would see on a letter of accommodation.  And that's how we went about organizing this. And   265 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:33,720 so if you receive a letter that says you need to  have extended time for a specific student, this   266 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:38,680 document's really easy because one, well, we have  this really nicely organized table of contents,   267 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:45,760 but everyone knows how to use Ctrl F. And so if  you do that and type in a leave of absence or   268 00:27:45,760 --> 00:27:54,680 extended time or whatever is pertinent on that  letter, there's then a full list of suggestions   269 00:27:54,680 --> 00:28:01,640 there that can be utilized within labs and how to  approach these certain situations. And Jennifer   270 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:07,920 alluded to this earlier, most of these have the  intention as well of having this sort of universal   271 00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:15,040 design or universal approach to these suggestions  as well. So that's kind of first and foremost,   272 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:21,600 is that the organization and how you can use  this was really intentional within our membership   273 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:29,120 and with the final publication in writing. Rachel earlier gave a quote I think in the   274 00:28:29,120 --> 00:28:36,080 middle of probably making this handbook and it  was, "You don't know that you need this resource   275 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:42,760 until you actually need it." And I think that  that is a really, a strong take home message   276 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:47,200 because a lot of instructors, they don't know that  they need more suggestions or they don't know if   277 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:52,280 they need additional help until they get a letter  of accommodation and it has a specific instance   278 00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:56,600 on there and you're saying, how the heck am I  supposed to do this in an anatomy lab where I have   279 00:28:56,600 --> 00:29:00,920 donors, or where they have to move around very  frequently, or they're looking at microscopes,   280 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:08,880 or there's many, many unique scenarios within the  A&P labs. So the idea there is that instructors,   281 00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:13,800 once you're given that letter, you can go to  this document, you can search for the specific   282 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:19,120 accommodation, and then you have, I'm not going  to say an exhaustive list, but they're really,   283 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:23,800 really great suggestions and for how to then  approach that accommodation so that students can   284 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:29,920 be successful within whatever learning activity  or whatever learning environment you're providing.  285 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:35,240 In the grand scheme of things, I think we  want to consider that this is going to be   286 00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:43,400 an ongoing or if you will, living document. And  so what the committee also decided was that these   287 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:51,160 suggestions or these suggestive lists are also  going to be ever evolving. And so we've decided   288 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:58,280 that at approximately every five years, we're  going to take the time to analyze and review   289 00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:05,640 these documents or this long document and these  sections to then have this substantial revision   290 00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:13,800 process. And so that's really what Jennifer has  already started. We've compiled even a document   291 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:19,720 already for revisions that we want to include  in the future because of some new legislation or   292 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:28,240 some new also suggestions that have came out even  recently. So I think this work that we've done is   293 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:33,600 very impactful and very useful for  now instructors within A&P, but it   294 00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:39,160 can also be transferable to other classrooms. But the kind of stamp on this is that we're   295 00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:46,240 doing this to create a better opportunity for  learning for our students, and I think that's   296 00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:50,920 kind of the take home message and the mission  between all of us working in this committee too,   297 00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:59,480 is that we're in these really unique opportunity  or these unique classroom opportunities to how   298 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:08,280 can we best focus our attention and our time so  that students can learn effectively and that's   299 00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:14,240 everyone in the classroom, not just students  who can see adequately or hear adequately. We   300 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:19,920 want to capture everyone. If you're hearing  this in the show notes, we also provided an   301 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:25,720 email so that if you have suggestions while  listening to this podcast, feel free to email   302 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:31,782 your suggestions and we're happy to include that  within our revision process in the future as well. 303 00:31:31,782 --> 00:31:34,160 >>Jennifer Stokes: If you don't mind, I kind of want to jump in a   304 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:40,800 little bit as well in terms of not just how to use  the handbook for accommodations, like the official   305 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:46,640 letters that we get, but I feel like also the  handbook. And I take this from my own experience   306 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:53,280 mostly because I learned so much just by helping  produce this, working with so many people with so   307 00:31:53,280 --> 00:32:00,080 much knowledge on these topics that through that  process I made notes like, oh, well I can make   308 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:06,320 this small change in my class and that'll benefit  everyone, particularly those students that may not   309 00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:11,480 think to speak up or necessarily want to because  maybe they don't have that official letter. And so   310 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:17,400 I think the handbook can also be used that way. If you just maybe are interested in making some   311 00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:22,840 small changes to your classes to increase  the accessibility and inclusivity, maybe   312 00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:26,800 look through the handbook. And you might find  a suggestion here or there that you could just   313 00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:33,240 implement to increase that aspect of your course  that wouldn't necessarily take you a lot of time,   314 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:39,986 but may have a pretty large impact in  the course. So just a thought as well. 315 00:32:39,986 --> 00:32:40,960 >>Rachel Hopp: The universal   316 00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:47,480 design aspect is huge. It has changed the way  that I teach A&P, just getting things ready   317 00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:52,705 from the get-go and just all the things  I've learned from the committee members. 318 00:32:52,705 --> 00:32:57,440 >>Kevin Patton: Let's take a breather.  319 00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:04,640 When I listen to podcasts or when I consume any  kind of presentation or media, I used to get   320 00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:14,320 annoyed at those intrusive breaks for advertising  or announcements like this one, but then I started   321 00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:21,880 running into anecdotes and actual research that  confirmed that such breaks can actually help   322 00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:29,600 us get more out of a podcast episode or other  presentation. Now that I know that such breaks   323 00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:37,680 are slightly less annoying. Research findings  are a little fuzzy on the exact best timing of   324 00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:45,920 the span between breaks and the best length of  a break, but a break of about a minute or two or   325 00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:56,240 three in between segments of 15 to 20 minutes  falls well within what's found to work best.   326 00:33:56,240 --> 00:34:06,120 Fine-tuning that is probably fuzzy because there's  such diversity in how our brains work best. A   327 00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:16,480 question that comes to mind is how do breaks help? Here are some possible answers that have emerged.   328 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:24,720 One is that breaks help us avoid cognitive  overload and that helps us process information.   329 00:34:24,720 --> 00:34:32,480 Another one is that breaks provide mental rest  that helps prevent fatigue. Another one is that   330 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:39,600 breaks divert our attention to something else  for a bit so that we can return to the content   331 00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:47,880 with fresh attention and re-engagement. Yet  another one is breaks help our brain compress   332 00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:57,400 and consolidate memories of what we just learned.  And yet another is because people learn best in 15   333 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:06,600 to 20 minute chunks, breaks provide a convenient  format to chunk the content of a long episode.   334 00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:12,080 I have some links in the show notes for this  episode if you're thinking about why and how   335 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:17,880 to incorporate breaks into your presentations.  Now, regular listeners may have noticed that   336 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:26,600 I started following this segment—break—segment  pattern for quite a while. It's to help you get   337 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:36,480 more out of each episode. You're welcome. Hey, break's over. Let's get back to it.  338 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:42,840 At several points in this conversation, a little  question or reflection would pop into my head,   339 00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:50,840 and then you guys addressed it directly and that's  awesome. You can tell that in working together,   340 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:58,000 you folks have developed a real feel for what  the needs of people like me are. That is for the   341 00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:04,200 ordinary in the trenches A&P instructor. What are  some of the issues? Going back to something Abbey   342 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:11,240 said about when you get one of those letters,  oh boy, as soon as you mentioned that I could,   343 00:36:11,240 --> 00:36:17,560 feels a little shift in my cardiac activity  because I've had a few cases where I've gotten   344 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:22,800 one of those letters and either didn't  understand what they were asking of me   345 00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:29,680 or didn't have a clue as to how I was going to  do that in the way that my course was set up.  346 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:35,360 So knowing that there's something like that  I think gives us all a reassurance that when   347 00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:42,160 we face that and we will face something new,  maybe we think we've seen it all, but there'll   348 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:48,000 be something that we haven't seen and now what  are we going to do? I really appreciate having   349 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:55,120 that resource available. And Jennifer and Rachel,  when you brought up the universal design aspect,   350 00:36:55,120 --> 00:37:01,640 I was kind of thinking along those lines just  as you were saying it, and that is something   351 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:06,680 else that I've learned along the way and I see  that you've incorporated into this document,   352 00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:14,560 is a lot of times I've found that when I'm doing  something to accommodate or support a particular   353 00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:21,200 population or potential population of students in  my courses or whatever, I find out that it helps   354 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:27,520 a bunch of other people. An example is not in my  regular classroom teaching, but in this podcast.   355 00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:34,880 I have from the beginning really worked hard to  provide transcripts and now some podcast players,   356 00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:38,960 including Apple Podcast has  captions that are available.  357 00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:46,040 All along I provided captions by way of YouTube  videos because in the early days of this podcast,   358 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:50,520 that was really the only option to provide  captions and I was thinking of people like   359 00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:57,440 me who are hard of hearing. A lot of us, we  may be able to hear some or maybe even most   360 00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:04,920 of what is being said in a podcast or in a video  or whatever, but there are some things we don't   361 00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:11,120 hear and it sometimes can affect the meaning  we take from it, especially in something like   362 00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:17,920 anatomy and physiology where the terminology is  so complex and a lot of terms are actually very   363 00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:24,200 similar to one another. And so if we mistake it  for something other than what was really spoken,   364 00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:29,640 then we could be in some trouble. And if it's  happening a lot in something we're trying to   365 00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:36,000 learn from, then it becomes an even bigger issue. So in that experience of providing transcripts   366 00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:41,320 and captions, I've had a lot of feedback from  people who do not consider themselves to be hard   367 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:48,000 of hearing, but they still use captions and they  still use transcripts for a variety of things.   368 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:53,120 Sometimes it's to fill in things they don't  quite hear. Maybe it's because my audio's bad,   369 00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:57,600 and we were kind of joking around a little bit  before we started recording about how I have   370 00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:02,080 this habit of turning away from the  microphone and my voice drops out. And   371 00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:08,240 so that could be filled in with a caption  where, hey, you didn't hear that phrase,   372 00:39:08,240 --> 00:39:13,880 but here it is in the captions. So that gets  back to that universal design idea of the   373 00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:19,960 more we can do to provide support for every  kind of learner, I think we're all going to   374 00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:26,280 be surprised. I continue to be surprised at  how many other people we're helping when we   375 00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:34,542 do that for reasons that just never occurred to  us when we were first providing those supports. 376 00:39:34,542 --> 00:39:36,200 >>Abbey Breckling: One other aspect that   377 00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:44,280 I would also like to touch on is that this  handbook is also a really great opportunity   378 00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:53,440 for instructors to create a conversation with  their own disability office. This is yes,   379 00:39:53,440 --> 00:40:00,160 specific to A&P, but sometimes and from my own  experiences, disability offices or accessibility   380 00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:04,520 offices, whatever the term is at your own  institution, they sometimes don't know how   381 00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:11,200 to approach specific accommodations in specific  labs or specific classes. And so I think also   382 00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:18,680 one of the goals of this guidebook is that it  can start conversations around how do we best   383 00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:23,440 support our students in our classroom? And  if that's specific to A&P, that's fantastic,   384 00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:31,225 but if it's for other courses, that's  even more exponential to our initial goal. 385 00:40:31,225 --> 00:40:32,080 >>Kevin Patton: An aspect of what   386 00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:39,520 you just said that really touched me is develop  those team-like relationships. I think that all   387 00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:45,600 of us work better that way, so it's a very good  point. I appreciate you bringing that up. Sort   388 00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:52,080 of related to that, something that you've  all mentioned in this conversation that I   389 00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:58,040 want to make sure I get to, and that is that  you've learned a lot along the way. I mean,   390 00:40:58,040 --> 00:41:05,360 how could you not learn new things in working  on this? So if each of you could share just one   391 00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:12,120 thing that you learned from this process that  you think would be helpful to anyone listening,   392 00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:17,982 that would be great. Jennifer, let's start with  you because you're first on my list here, so. 393 00:41:17,982 --> 00:41:19,985 >>Jennifer Stokes: Oh man. Calling me out. All right. 394 00:41:19,985 --> 00:41:21,942 >>Kevin Patton: Yeah. I told you I was going to do that. 395 00:41:21,942 --> 00:41:26,520 >>Jennifer Stokes: I know, I know. And I wasn't prepared. No,   396 00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:32,480 I would say one of the biggest things that came  from working with so many people was just so I'm   397 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:38,320 in a small institution, we're a small liberal  arts institution, and so when it comes to both   398 00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:44,480 the number of official accommodations that I get  as well as kind of the range of them, I would say   399 00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:51,600 in my experience, pretty limited based on what  I hear other faculty members are and having to   400 00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:57,560 accommodate in their labs. And so that has allowed  me to really kind of reflect on my teaching   401 00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:02,800 and then also kind of preemptively prepare for  some things that will eventually probably come   402 00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:09,600 my way that I will be asked to accommodate  in class. So it's allowed me to think ahead,   403 00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:13,440 right, which kind of going back to what  Rachel and Abbey have said, you don't know   404 00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:19,200 that you need this until you need it. Right. And so it kind of allowed me to prepare kind   405 00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:24,040 of in advance. Okay. So if I do have a student  that comes in that's going to be working in   406 00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:29,440 my A&P class in a wheelchair with some physical  accommodations, what can I do now to go ahead and   407 00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:35,480 start to prepare for that? Then in the end, it's  also going to benefit everyone else as well. Also,   408 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:40,560 I've learned a lot about some of these other  accommodations or maybe even temporary conditions,   409 00:42:40,560 --> 00:42:45,280 different things that again, just never thought  about, but it's helped kind of open my eyes and my   410 00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:50,865 mind to different things that I can potentially  accommodate in the lab to help everyone. 411 00:42:50,865 --> 00:42:51,600 >>Kevin Patton: So Abbey,   412 00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:56,702 what about you? What's something that  you learned in this whole process? 413 00:42:56,702 --> 00:42:57,520 >>Abbey Breckling: Oh, gosh.   414 00:42:57,520 --> 00:43:04,120 I've learned so much. It's hard to pick  one. I think what I've sort of taken away,   415 00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:08,720 I'm not going to give you one example because I  don't think I can actually pick one, but I think   416 00:43:08,720 --> 00:43:16,240 I've learned to just sort of pay attention also to  my surroundings. I have a good family friend who   417 00:43:16,240 --> 00:43:20,840 is actually a pastry chef and she was doing these  classes and she wanted to make sure that when she   418 00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:26,520 was standing at the front of the classroom,  that everyone else in the audience could see,   419 00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:33,240 and so she had this really thin mirrored plastic  that was angled so that they could see what was   420 00:43:33,240 --> 00:43:40,040 in the bowl and what she was working with. And  I'm like, oh my gosh, I can totally use this in a   421 00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:46,040 classroom. I mean, you'd have to involve a little  bit of maintenance individuals probably to hang   422 00:43:46,040 --> 00:43:54,360 this object, but what a great thing to utilize  in a lab classroom or over a donor table so that   423 00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:59,440 everyone can see maybe how I'm dissecting  and so that other students could see it.  424 00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:04,960 I have yet to implement this. But I think it's  just being aware of your surroundings and how,   425 00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:13,440 not just in a classroom, but how are other people  approaching this topic and how can we bring that   426 00:44:13,440 --> 00:44:20,105 into our classrooms as well? So little nuances  like that I think have really opened up my eyes. 427 00:44:20,105 --> 00:44:20,720 >>Kevin Patton: I'm going to use   428 00:44:20,720 --> 00:44:25,640 one of those. That sounds pretty cool. And  I know what you're talking about. I think   429 00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:30,440 I've seen at least something similar. That  would be awesome for a lab. We're going to   430 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:34,542 start seeing a lot more of those now that  you've mentioned that on this podcast. 431 00:44:34,542 --> 00:44:35,240 >>Abbey Breckling: I think they're   432 00:44:35,240 --> 00:44:38,506 pretty common in cooking classes, but. 433 00:44:38,506 --> 00:44:43,422 >>Rachel Hopp: The Julia Child method from her TV show. 434 00:44:43,422 --> 00:44:44,425 >>Abbey Breckling: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 435 00:44:44,425 --> 00:44:45,160 >>Kevin Patton: All right. Well, she was   436 00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:48,986 a great teacher, right? I mean, look at how  many people have learned to cook from her. 437 00:44:48,986 --> 00:44:50,040 >>Rachel Hopp: Well, they had that show   438 00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:54,105 about her show and yeah, she developed that idea. 439 00:44:54,105 --> 00:44:55,200 >>Kevin Patton: Oh, she did? I didn't   440 00:44:55,200 --> 00:45:00,040 realize that she use, oh wow. Now I'm  even more impressed with her than I was   441 00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:05,906 before. So cool. Well, Rachel, what about  you? What are some things that you've... 442 00:45:05,906 --> 00:45:06,760 >>Rachel Hopp: A lot of the things   443 00:45:06,760 --> 00:45:12,000 that have already been said. We are fortunate  enough to be going through a lab redesign,   444 00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:17,960 so that really having the information from the  handbook helped me think about the space for   445 00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:23,320 students that might be in wheelchairs and so  forth, like all those things. But I think one   446 00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:29,440 of the things that was a real aha moment, and I  haven't gotten to use this particular one yet,   447 00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:35,520 but I thought that is so cool when I heard it  within the committee was if you had something   448 00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:42,880 sharp or hot on the lab bench and you had a  student that was visually impaired and they   449 00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:48,160 might not see it, you can put sandpaper  on the bench right near that object,   450 00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:55,360 so whether it's a Bunsen burner or anything else,  that they can feel that change in texture and have   451 00:45:55,360 --> 00:46:00,785 a warning sign. And I thought that's genius. I  never would've thought to do something like that. 452 00:46:00,785 --> 00:46:01,880 >>Kevin Patton: That's a cool tip.   453 00:46:01,880 --> 00:46:07,760 That kind of reminds me of those little  bumps that are on the crosswalks on roads   454 00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:12,106 and that kind of give a tactual  warning. That's a neat idea. 455 00:46:12,106 --> 00:46:14,880 >>Rachel Hopp: And I guess one more on the tactile was like   456 00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:21,440 it would take time, but you have some instructors  or artistic or their students might be artistic,   457 00:46:21,440 --> 00:46:28,400 but you can have them use puffy paints to draw  things in two dimensions that can be felt because   458 00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:34,760 of their texture change, like the shape of a cell  and all of its organelles could be done in puffy   459 00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:40,040 paints and things like that, which can be tactile.  Things I had never thought about doing and I   460 00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:46,225 haven't used them, but I have them tucked away now  that when that occasion arises, I'm ready for it. 461 00:46:46,225 --> 00:46:46,840 >>Kevin Patton: That might be one   462 00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:53,742 that would be just fun to do anyway,  for everybody to make a puffy cell. 463 00:46:53,742 --> 00:46:55,080 >>Jennifer Stokes: That actually put into   464 00:46:55,080 --> 00:47:00,680 one of our revision topic that we have on  our list for when we start to go through the   465 00:47:00,680 --> 00:47:05,880 handbook and update it for the next iteration,  is we've actually connected with people at the   466 00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:12,240 last HAPS annual meeting that work on 3D  printed models of cells or other things   467 00:47:12,240 --> 00:47:17,240 that allow for visually impaired individuals  to learn in more of the tactile fashion. And   468 00:47:17,240 --> 00:47:23,040 3D printing is relatively cheap compared to a lot  of different things that are out there. So yeah,   469 00:47:23,040 --> 00:47:29,025 that actually is something that  will be looked at for future ideas. 470 00:47:29,025 --> 00:47:33,880 >>Kevin Patton: Let's take a quick break.  471 00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:41,600 Break time again. Hey, in every episode of this  podcast at some point I mention that I have links   472 00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:48,200 available in the show notes. Now you may already  have a clear idea of what I mean by show notes,   473 00:47:48,200 --> 00:47:55,360 but maybe not. I'm referring to a set of  information and resources that relate to   474 00:47:55,360 --> 00:48:02,440 a specific episode. The show notes start with  a quick take, which is a brief summary of the   475 00:48:02,440 --> 00:48:11,640 episode, just a few sentences along with a time  stamped list of each segment and break. In audio   476 00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:18,560 media lingo, these are called chapters, and  you can skip directly to any of the chapters   477 00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:26,920 by using the time stamps and or using the skip  feature in the app where you're listening.   478 00:48:26,920 --> 00:48:35,560 Not all apps have that skip -chapter button,  but they all let you go to a specific time.  479 00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:42,400 Next in the show notes is an embedded audio player  set to play that specific episode. And just under   480 00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:48,880 that, is the main body of notes starting with the  quotation that you always hear at the beginning   481 00:48:48,880 --> 00:48:55,760 of each episode. And then it lists a subtitle  and length for each segment along with a short   482 00:48:55,760 --> 00:49:03,840 summary for that segment. And then there's a list  of links to references and resources that relate   483 00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:10,200 to the content of the episode. And then after  that is a link to the digital credential for   484 00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:16,000 professional development that you can claim for  listening to the episode. And that's followed by a   485 00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:23,480 video player that plays the captioned audiogram of  the episode. And below that is a full transcript   486 00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:29,160 of the episode and that's a searchable transcript. So if you can't remember which episode it was that   487 00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:36,680 you heard five or six years ago about a particular  topic, just search within the website and you'll   488 00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:42,720 find it. Actually just searching within Google  will often get you there pretty easily. At the   489 00:49:42,720 --> 00:49:49,520 very bottom of each set of show notes is a  pre-formatted citation that you can use if   490 00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:56,240 you refer to the episode in any of your own  work. And that's it. That's enough, isn't it?  491 00:49:56,240 --> 00:50:02,160 That's a lot of stuff there. Well, if it's not  enough for you, then let me know what's missing   492 00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:07,440 and I'll see about putting it in there.  We'll try to work that out. By the way,   493 00:50:07,440 --> 00:50:14,040 all of these elements are present in the show  notes at the episode page at the website. That   494 00:50:14,040 --> 00:50:22,160 is theAPprofessor.org. The show notes  are also usually available in the blog,   495 00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:31,840 The A&P Professor podcast app and other podcasts  or music apps or wherever you listen to audio.   496 00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:39,200 However, there's always some elements that are  missing just because of the way each particular   497 00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:45,520 platform is formatted and the kind of data or  element that it can handle. If it's not missing,   498 00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:51,560 it might be truncated, but there'll always  be a link to the episode page at The A&P   499 00:50:51,560 --> 00:50:56,640 Professor website where all of those  elements are there in their full glory.   500 00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:03,600 So hey, you know what? Let's  get back to our main program.  501 00:51:03,600 --> 00:51:09,800 Okay. Well there's obviously a lot of people  involved in this and they did. Oh my gosh,   502 00:51:09,800 --> 00:51:16,200 looking at what came out of this and understanding  in these projects how much work has to go on in   503 00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:23,840 the background to produce something of this size  and quality. Man, that's really something. I mean,   504 00:51:23,840 --> 00:51:30,200 that's really an accomplishment. And I'm so  grateful as an educator myself to have something   505 00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:36,040 like this that I can always refer back to. It's  pretty huge. I mean, there are a lot of different   506 00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:42,840 things in there that I'm sure that I'm not going  to be needing to refer to all of them all at once,   507 00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:48,920 but knowing that they're there is helpful so  that when I do need this part or that part or   508 00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:56,720 the other part, that there's a place I can go  and at least start there and if not end there   509 00:51:56,720 --> 00:52:04,200 as well as far as any help I would need in order  to serve my students for their accommodations,   510 00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:10,520 whatever it is they need to be successful. So as I'm just kind of scanning over the   511 00:52:10,520 --> 00:52:18,040 table of contents of the handbook, well one thing  that pops out here that is somewhat unexpected,   512 00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:23,080 but it does make sense, but I wasn't thinking  along these lines and that is considerations   513 00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:30,800 for temporary conditions. So what's that  about? What are some examples of temporary   514 00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:38,062 conditions and how is that useful to me as an  instructor? Abbey, you want to handle that? 515 00:52:38,062 --> 00:52:41,040 >>Abbey Breckling: Personally, think that this section of   516 00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:49,200 the handbook was probably one of the more organic  sections. As you've heard throughout our session   517 00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:55,640 today, that we had a lot of people working on this  handbook and a lot of these accommodations were   518 00:52:55,640 --> 00:53:02,880 coming from past experiences that our subcommittee  members had dealt with over the years. And we   519 00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:08,040 started to get this list of, oh, well, I had a  student come in with a broken bone and they needed   520 00:53:08,040 --> 00:53:14,440 an accommodation for one or two exams, or I had  a student who was pregnant and I had to make some   521 00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:22,600 alterations in my class or my lab for that student  to continue. So this section is or was super   522 00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:27,800 organic in the construction of it and it was truly  gathered really, or the initial stages from just   523 00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:36,760 past experiences. So this section for temporary  condition is thought to be certain accommodations   524 00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:42,840 that are not on a continuum, meaning that a  student's going to come in and maybe they only   525 00:53:42,840 --> 00:53:50,960 have this accommodation for a semester or half  a semester or maybe a few exams in that case.  526 00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:58,800 So we wanted to provide a list or suggestions  for how to approach these accommodations when   527 00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:03,720 maybe you're not thinking of these all the  time, but there are these one-offs sort of   528 00:54:03,720 --> 00:54:11,120 situations. So for instance, if someone has an  allergic reaction, we've provided some examples.   529 00:54:11,120 --> 00:54:19,080 What about conjunctivitis or pink eye or like I  mentioned before, pregnancy or even after labor   530 00:54:19,080 --> 00:54:24,960 and delivery, right, thinking about students  who maybe are nursing as well. So we provided   531 00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:30,160 these long lists of, all right, if we're not  dealing with these on this long-term basis,   532 00:54:30,160 --> 00:54:36,280 we can still as instructors on a short-term  basis, how do we create an equitable learning   533 00:54:36,280 --> 00:54:44,520 environment for anyone who potentially may  have need? This section is long, but I think   534 00:54:44,520 --> 00:54:50,680 we spent a lot of time on one of our sections with  physical accommodation. Jennifer, I know that you   535 00:54:50,680 --> 00:54:56,320 spent a lot of time on this. Maybe you want to  comment on some of the physical accommodations. 536 00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:59,520 >>Jennifer Stokes: Yeah, absolutely. Thank you Abbey. And   537 00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:04,000 I actually feel that this section, the physical  accommodation section goes hand in hand with some   538 00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:09,240 of the temporary conditions as well. So as an  instructor within the kinesiology department,   539 00:55:09,240 --> 00:55:13,720 I have a number of student athletes in my  courses, and so it is not uncommon that any   540 00:55:13,720 --> 00:55:18,760 given week I will have a student come in either  having concussion issues or maybe they broke a   541 00:55:18,760 --> 00:55:23,360 bone in a recent match or something. And so we  are constantly accommodating or having to come   542 00:55:23,360 --> 00:55:28,560 up with creative solutions to still help protect  their health and wellness while allowing them to   543 00:55:28,560 --> 00:55:34,440 succeed in the class. And some of those can be  found within the physical accommodation section   544 00:55:34,440 --> 00:55:38,880 and in working on this section collaboratively  with other individuals on the subcommittee,   545 00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:44,240 definitely learned a lot about other options that  I can provide in the lab to help my students.  546 00:55:44,240 --> 00:55:49,760 For example, you can pick up beakers like lab  beakers that use to measure different liquids,   547 00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:54,720 but they have a handle on them, making them  easier to carry because it's a smaller grip   548 00:55:54,720 --> 00:55:58,600 versus a larger grip, different strength  involved there. And so that's definitely   549 00:55:58,600 --> 00:56:02,120 something that might be worth considering  just having around in case you might need   550 00:56:02,120 --> 00:56:07,080 it on the fly because you have a temporary  accommodation. Other examples include sinks   551 00:56:07,080 --> 00:56:11,840 with lever handles, making them easier to  turn or spring-loaded garden scissors instead   552 00:56:11,840 --> 00:56:17,040 of dissection shears that are easier  to use if you have dexterity issues,   553 00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:21,960 which could be due to a long-term condition  or maybe a temporary condition because you   554 00:56:21,960 --> 00:56:26,240 strained your wrist or something in practice. One of the things I think is really important   555 00:56:26,800 --> 00:56:30,440 that we have in our handbook as well is  pictures of all of these. So if you're like,   556 00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:34,360 what are spring-loaded scissors or what does a  beaker with a handle look like? You can check   557 00:56:34,360 --> 00:56:40,160 out the handbook and we have pictures in there to  show you what this new piece of equipment might   558 00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:44,920 look like. And yeah, I've definitely moved to  having in my lab some of these just available in   559 00:56:44,920 --> 00:56:50,800 case students might need them or to have them on  hand for when another accommodation comes in. So   560 00:56:50,800 --> 00:56:55,520 definitely something to consider. And another  accommodation section that I think deserves   561 00:56:55,520 --> 00:57:00,786 a good mention is the visual accommodation  section. Rachel, do you have thoughts on that? 562 00:57:00,786 --> 00:57:02,360 >>Rachel Hopp: I do want to speak on the   563 00:57:02,360 --> 00:57:08,480 visual accommodation section. A lot of times we  are getting a letter of accommodation request that   564 00:57:08,480 --> 00:57:15,520 says a student's going to need to use a screen  reader or have access to material in large or   565 00:57:15,520 --> 00:57:22,200 specific font or something like that. And so we  might anticipate that our student's going to need   566 00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:29,720 some visually specific materials that are going to  have to be accommodated for working in an A&P lab,   567 00:57:29,720 --> 00:57:37,240 it comes to mind right away are models and using  a microscope. And so models can actually be   568 00:57:37,240 --> 00:57:45,000 labeled with braille or different kinds of bump  dots that are physically able to be touched,   569 00:57:45,000 --> 00:57:52,600 but there's also these really cool audible labels.  And so you attach these labels and then you use a   570 00:57:52,600 --> 00:57:59,280 pen-like device and it actually reads whatever  is on the label. And so these are actually not   571 00:57:59,280 --> 00:58:04,560 that expensive. You can get them on Amazon and  places like that because people use them in their   572 00:58:04,560 --> 00:58:11,640 homes to be able to read labels on things like  canned food or items in their medicine cabinet.  573 00:58:11,640 --> 00:58:17,360 And so one of the cool things working on this  subcommittee is finding these dual-purpose   574 00:58:17,360 --> 00:58:25,120 uses of equipment that's already out there and  also two-dimensional pictures can be enhanced   575 00:58:25,120 --> 00:58:33,520 with some type of embossing or even puffy paints  for microscopes. You can have microscope images   576 00:58:33,520 --> 00:58:42,360 that are enlarged or even color corrected on a  computer, or you may use printed photos instead. I   577 00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:49,120 recently had a class where I gave a lab practical  where I use both microscopes and printed pictures   578 00:58:49,120 --> 00:58:56,320 for every slide for the whole class. So all  students had the same kinds of accessibility for   579 00:58:56,320 --> 00:59:06,480 that. And you can have specific 3D printed models  that can provide some customized solutions. For   580 00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:13,600 safety, screen readers or braille compatible  devices might be necessary in the lab if you   581 00:59:13,600 --> 00:59:20,680 have any safety instructions that are posted  around the lab that other people are reading   582 00:59:20,680 --> 00:59:26,400 the visual print. So you might need to  have some accessible writing on those.  583 00:59:26,400 --> 00:59:33,680 And then as far as universal design tips, of  course most of us already know about alt-text   584 00:59:33,680 --> 00:59:40,360 labels, so those are descriptions that you put  whenever you're using an image and something so   585 00:59:40,360 --> 00:59:48,560 that a screen reader can read it. We also found  out in another C&I subcommittee that tables of   586 00:59:48,560 --> 00:59:58,400 text can create problems for screen readers.  And so trying to avoid using tables and then   587 00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:07,320 of course using large fonts and optimizing your  contrast is important for visuals and trying to   588 01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:14,960 avoid things like use of red and green or  blue and yellow as color pairings. Don't   589 01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:20,240 put a green arrow on top of a red structure or  something like that. And so those are things   590 01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:26,120 you can be doing whenever you're building  new materials so that in the future if you   591 01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:32,200 need this accommodation, it's already kind  of baked in how you've made your materials.   592 01:00:32,200 --> 01:00:36,920 And so all of those were really cool things  that I learned in the process of being on   593 01:00:36,920 --> 01:00:43,385 this subcommittee and have been trying to keep  implementing those as I develop new materials. 594 01:00:43,385 --> 01:00:46,040 >>Kevin Patton: Well, the more you three talk about this and the   595 01:00:46,040 --> 01:00:52,640 more I scan through what I see here, the more I  realize I really want to dive into this. And man,   596 01:00:52,640 --> 01:00:58,800 I wish I would've had a beaker with a handle when  I was doing labs as an undergraduate student just   597 01:00:58,800 --> 01:01:03,280 because I'm clumsy. I don't know if I could  have gotten an official accommodation for that,   598 01:01:03,280 --> 01:01:07,760 but it sure would've helped me. But that kind  of gets to what has been mentioned a few times   599 01:01:07,760 --> 01:01:13,080 already and that is this whole idea of universal  design, that the more of these things we build   600 01:01:13,080 --> 01:01:20,760 in for maybe thinking of a specific case, or a  specific student, or just knowledge of the fact   601 01:01:20,760 --> 01:01:26,560 that this might come up in the future, it's going  to help all students or at least potentially can   602 01:01:26,560 --> 01:01:33,920 help all students. So this is an awesome project. Well, I'm glad to hear that HAPS and its   603 01:01:33,920 --> 01:01:39,600 committees and this committee are going to  continue to work on these things and keep them   604 01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:46,560 updated and as things change because they will  and add to it with new ideas. And I'm thinking   605 01:01:46,560 --> 01:01:53,040 now we need to get you folks together again for  another episode sometime where we can go through   606 01:01:53,040 --> 01:01:58,560 all these tips that you've run across because  I think that'd be a fabulous episode that would   607 01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:05,160 really get people thinking about ways they can  incorporate some of this stuff in their teaching.   608 01:02:05,160 --> 01:02:11,760 Thanks so much for all of you making the time to  get together and coordinating with each other so   609 01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:18,720 we could find a good time. Thanks not only for  your discussion today helping us understand this   610 01:02:18,720 --> 01:02:24,600 new Anatomy & Physiology Student Accommodations  Handbook, but thank you also for all the hard   611 01:02:24,600 --> 01:02:31,160 work you and everyone that you've mentioned  has done to bring this to fruition and launch   612 01:02:31,160 --> 01:02:38,502 this into the world. So I wish you luck as this  all continues, and I appreciate your being here. 613 01:02:38,502 --> 01:02:40,342 >>Jennifer Stokes: Thank you, Kevin for having us. 614 01:02:40,342 --> 01:02:41,506 >>Abbey Breckling: Thanks, Kevin. 615 01:02:41,506 --> 01:02:45,105 >>Rachel Hopp: Thank you, Kevin. 616 01:02:45,105 --> 01:02:48,520 >>Kevin Patton: I can't tell you how much   617 01:02:48,520 --> 01:02:59,680 I've needed this. For decades I've needed a source  to go to, a starting place for accommodations that   618 01:02:59,680 --> 01:03:06,520 is particularly geared to teaching anatomy  and physiology. I've needed this many times   619 01:03:06,520 --> 01:03:11,800 and I wish it was there and I'm glad it's here  now. I'm so grateful to this group within the   620 01:03:11,800 --> 01:03:18,720 Human Anatomy & Physiology Society for putting  their shoulders to it and doing the hard work   621 01:03:18,720 --> 01:03:24,880 of getting together all of this advice and all  of these resources so that we have a starting   622 01:03:24,880 --> 01:03:31,280 point. And it's within the umbrella of HAPS, which  means that not only do we have a starting point,   623 01:03:31,280 --> 01:03:38,400 we have a built-in network of colleagues that  we can lean on, and get advice from, and share   624 01:03:38,400 --> 01:03:45,680 ideas with, and figure things out. I've had a lot  of fun just going through the manual and seeing   625 01:03:45,680 --> 01:03:52,080 the different kinds of things that are there. I really recommend that you do take a few minutes   626 01:03:52,080 --> 01:03:58,520 to go through and at least skim through what kinds  of things are there and have it handy, have a link   627 01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:03,520 to it handy or a printout of it handy so that  when the time comes when you're going to need   628 01:04:03,520 --> 01:04:10,520 this part or that part, you'll know exactly where  to start. I have some links in the show notes,   629 01:04:10,520 --> 01:04:16,480 and if you don't see the links in your podcast  player, go to the show notes at the episode page   630 01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:25,720 at theAPprofessor.org/151 where you can explore  any of the ideas mentioned in this podcast.   631 01:04:26,320 --> 01:04:30,600 And while you're there, you can claim your  digital credential for listening to this   632 01:04:30,600 --> 01:04:36,680 episode. And you're always encouraged to call  in with your questions, comments, and ideas at   633 01:04:36,680 --> 01:04:49,120 the podcast hotline. That's 1-833-LION-DEN, or  1-833-546-6336. Or send a recording message to   634 01:04:49,120 --> 01:04:55,640 podcast@theAPprofessor.org.  I'll see you down the road. 635 01:04:55,640 --> 01:04:59,600 >>Aileen Park:  636 01:04:59,600 --> 01:05:02,880 The A&P Professor is hosted by Dr. Kevin Patton,   637 01:05:02,880 --> 01:05:14,145 an award-winning professor and textbook  author in human anatomy and physiology. 638 01:05:14,145 --> 01:05:15,920 >>Kevin Patton: Caution. Do not   639 01:05:15,920 --> 01:05:25,640 use this episode near fire, flame, or sparks.