1 00:00:00,290 --> 00:00:06,180 You're listening to A Very Spatial Podcast, episode 752, December 17th, 2024. 2 00:00:26,990 --> 00:00:28,460 Hello and welcome to A Very Spatial Podcast. 3 00:00:28,470 --> 00:00:29,030 I'm Jesse. 4 00:00:29,340 --> 00:00:29,900 I'm Sue. 5 00:00:30,479 --> 00:00:30,939 I'm Barb. 6 00:00:30,979 --> 00:00:31,799 And this is Frank. 7 00:00:31,869 --> 00:00:36,510 And this week we're going to talk about things including World LiDAR 8 00:00:36,529 --> 00:00:38,540 Day is coming up on February 12th. 9 00:00:39,310 --> 00:00:40,050 Just wanted to let you know. 10 00:00:40,330 --> 00:00:40,640 That's it. 11 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:42,300 What is World LiDAR Day? 12 00:00:42,690 --> 00:00:45,620 It's the day that we recognize LiDAR all around the world. 13 00:00:45,790 --> 00:00:47,559 Is it, but is it just world? 14 00:00:48,065 --> 00:00:53,285 LIDAR day as opposed to ground LIDAR, or do we recognize ground LIDAR? 15 00:00:53,285 --> 00:00:57,915 I think it's all kinds of LIDAR being recognized from aerial to terrestrial 16 00:00:58,345 --> 00:01:01,535 and all the uses in all of those. 17 00:01:02,305 --> 00:01:04,244 The world best recognized LIDAR. 18 00:01:04,334 --> 00:01:05,064 Okay, that's cool. 19 00:01:05,104 --> 00:01:05,565 That's cool. 20 00:01:06,470 --> 00:01:09,990 The WMM, the World Magnetic Model, has been updated. 21 00:01:10,320 --> 00:01:15,390 This is what tells us the magnetic north for things like navigation systems. 22 00:01:15,390 --> 00:01:19,049 It's been updated by the UK Defense Geographic Center, the US National 23 00:01:19,050 --> 00:01:23,819 Geospatial Intelligence Agency, the US NOAA, National Oceanic 24 00:01:24,299 --> 00:01:28,179 and Atmospheric Administration, and the British Geologic Survey. 25 00:01:29,189 --> 00:01:33,619 I think really most importantly brought to you by the poles, the 26 00:01:33,619 --> 00:01:35,779 magnetic sphere, that's helping us. 27 00:01:36,369 --> 00:01:38,739 You know, not bake from solar radiation. 28 00:01:39,389 --> 00:01:39,689 Yeah. 29 00:01:39,689 --> 00:01:43,279 And, and equally as importantly, it's been updated because they're 30 00:01:43,279 --> 00:01:48,549 slightly different than they were natural, which is just natural. 31 00:01:48,559 --> 00:01:49,379 That happens. 32 00:01:49,389 --> 00:01:50,339 Don't freak out. 33 00:01:50,339 --> 00:01:52,319 It's goes on. 34 00:01:52,559 --> 00:01:55,619 And in fact, at some point, the North pole will be the South pole. 35 00:01:55,629 --> 00:01:57,000 The South pole will be the North pole. 36 00:01:57,299 --> 00:02:00,229 Nobody knows when it's a little freaky to me. 37 00:02:01,829 --> 00:02:07,119 I think one of the things is that I miss about having quads as kind of a normal 38 00:02:07,129 --> 00:02:12,819 class thing in the geospatial classes is the, the lack of the declination 39 00:02:13,399 --> 00:02:16,969 angle at the bottom of the quad that showed you, okay, well, this was 40 00:02:16,989 --> 00:02:22,239 where magnetic north was the year that we made this iteration of the quad. 41 00:02:22,859 --> 00:02:23,609 No, just me. 42 00:02:23,619 --> 00:02:23,949 Okay. 43 00:02:24,599 --> 00:02:25,239 Well, you know what? 44 00:02:25,249 --> 00:02:27,479 I never actually paid attention to that. 45 00:02:27,829 --> 00:02:30,129 So now that you're thinking, I was like, oh yeah, that is on there. 46 00:02:30,129 --> 00:02:30,994 That is kind of cool. 47 00:02:31,634 --> 00:02:33,964 If they update it, it's going to have greater accuracy. 48 00:02:34,084 --> 00:02:36,804 It's something that we use all the time without thinking about it. 49 00:02:37,314 --> 00:02:38,724 And this makes it better. 50 00:02:39,204 --> 00:02:43,374 So scientists in Hawaii, in conjunction with a Canadian company that works 51 00:02:43,374 --> 00:02:48,214 with drones have been using drone technology and they found a rare type 52 00:02:48,214 --> 00:02:52,374 of orchid that's actually more common than they thought when they started to 53 00:02:52,384 --> 00:02:56,269 use the drones and, you know, Drone to mapping to start to map where it is. 54 00:02:56,639 --> 00:03:00,539 And this is part of a larger partnership that they're doing to 55 00:03:00,539 --> 00:03:03,129 look into plant extinction prevention. 56 00:03:03,489 --> 00:03:07,779 It's just really interesting because again, it shows you that what you think, 57 00:03:07,789 --> 00:03:12,169 you know, and then what you actually find out by using different types of geospatial 58 00:03:12,179 --> 00:03:14,709 technology can be vastly different things. 59 00:03:15,004 --> 00:03:17,984 I just want to say the really cool thing about that news item to my 60 00:03:17,984 --> 00:03:21,674 mind is that you think, well, haven't we seen everything from above? 61 00:03:21,704 --> 00:03:24,494 Well, Actually, the interesting about this plant is in the middle 62 00:03:24,494 --> 00:03:29,464 of a 2000 foot cliff and you can't get it from above or below and the 63 00:03:29,464 --> 00:03:31,814 rocks are treacherous and crumbly. 64 00:03:31,814 --> 00:03:33,894 So even if you try to climb over there, you'd probably fall. 65 00:03:34,164 --> 00:03:38,144 So literally until we got drone technology able to do this, which has 66 00:03:38,144 --> 00:03:41,774 been around for a while, but they used it for the first time, they couldn't get 67 00:03:41,784 --> 00:03:43,934 at it to see that that's pretty cool. 68 00:03:43,934 --> 00:03:44,264 I think 69 00:03:45,184 --> 00:03:47,824 it goes along with the, the awesome band name. 70 00:03:48,764 --> 00:03:51,964 And I can't remember if it's Zach or somebody from UNCP that, that 71 00:03:51,964 --> 00:03:53,304 we came up with the band name. 72 00:03:54,094 --> 00:03:55,124 Niches for Finches. 73 00:03:56,544 --> 00:03:56,984 There you go. 74 00:03:57,799 --> 00:04:00,139 But now that's just the news I just thought that was really cool. 75 00:04:00,269 --> 00:04:02,769 Yeah, so niches for orchids wait not orchids. 76 00:04:03,159 --> 00:04:04,239 It's actually a new species 77 00:04:04,279 --> 00:04:06,119 It says it belongs to the carnation family 78 00:04:06,119 --> 00:04:08,439 So niches for carnations. 79 00:04:08,439 --> 00:04:08,869 There we go. 80 00:04:08,949 --> 00:04:10,169 That actually works better than orchids. 81 00:04:10,169 --> 00:04:11,459 So niches for carnations 82 00:04:12,129 --> 00:04:12,589 Yeah 83 00:04:13,839 --> 00:04:15,209 Not cliffs for carnations 84 00:04:15,759 --> 00:04:21,049 Yeah, but you kind of lose the the the connection to to that guy 85 00:04:21,639 --> 00:04:22,339 charles darwin 86 00:04:22,889 --> 00:04:23,889 evolution guy 87 00:04:24,604 --> 00:04:26,484 Charles Darwin and others, you know, 88 00:04:26,484 --> 00:04:28,304 he had a had beagles and. 89 00:04:29,529 --> 00:04:32,809 And it may just be the guitarist to me, it makes me think of Cliffs Dover by Eric 90 00:04:32,819 --> 00:04:34,479 Johnson, which is a whole different thing. 91 00:04:35,929 --> 00:04:41,369 In a web corner that Barb found is the Whatsapp, Whatsapp chat map. 92 00:04:41,869 --> 00:04:43,429 Okay, that's just evil for names. 93 00:04:43,909 --> 00:04:44,809 Whatsapp chat map. 94 00:04:45,359 --> 00:04:50,319 And so what this is, is humanity, wow, just terrible tonight. 95 00:04:50,529 --> 00:04:54,919 Humanitarian OpenStreetMap team got a call for, hey, we want to 96 00:04:54,919 --> 00:04:58,394 do some some Mapping and they're like, you know, what's a really easy 97 00:04:58,394 --> 00:04:59,494 way that we can make this happen. 98 00:04:59,504 --> 00:05:02,554 They're like, hey, you know There's this cool app that everybody uses 99 00:05:02,554 --> 00:05:07,924 called WhatsApp, you know in the need for creating Map data very quickly very 100 00:05:07,924 --> 00:05:11,274 easily with something that already exists They're like, you know lots of people 101 00:05:11,274 --> 00:05:16,064 use WhatsApp and if you use WhatsApp chat it can keep your location history 102 00:05:16,065 --> 00:05:20,274 if you want to if you give it the chance to and so folks came along and 103 00:05:20,274 --> 00:05:23,539 created the chat map dot H-O-T-O-S-M. 104 00:05:23,539 --> 00:05:31,689 So hot osm uh.org page where you can take existing WhatsApp chats. 105 00:05:32,139 --> 00:05:35,769 You can export those from the chat in the app, WhatsApp app, 106 00:05:37,029 --> 00:05:38,889 and bring it into the chat map. 107 00:05:39,459 --> 00:05:41,349 Hot sm.org page. 108 00:05:41,784 --> 00:05:47,104 And it'll give you a map and so yeah, I had a map that we 109 00:05:47,104 --> 00:05:49,804 had done a group chat in Japan. 110 00:05:49,894 --> 00:05:50,504 Oh, it's gone. 111 00:05:51,134 --> 00:05:56,624 And it was interesting to see, you know, what happened whenever you take your data. 112 00:05:56,624 --> 00:06:00,534 If you, and we only had a few people who had location enabled in the chat. 113 00:06:00,544 --> 00:06:03,044 So it wasn't a bunch of points, but it's. 114 00:06:03,779 --> 00:06:07,369 It works, and it's, you know, something that lots of people 115 00:06:07,369 --> 00:06:08,499 already have on their phone. 116 00:06:08,559 --> 00:06:10,919 They're already using it for communication anyway. 117 00:06:11,419 --> 00:06:14,439 You don't necessarily have to have multiple people in the chat, but 118 00:06:14,439 --> 00:06:19,459 if you have a lot of people working on one data collection, why not? 119 00:06:20,429 --> 00:06:22,079 And so then you just bring down one chat. 120 00:06:22,079 --> 00:06:24,399 So it's a nice little tool. 121 00:06:24,729 --> 00:06:26,539 And WhatsApp is very, very popular 122 00:06:26,599 --> 00:06:26,879 around the 123 00:06:26,889 --> 00:06:27,269 world. 124 00:06:27,369 --> 00:06:27,749 Yes. 125 00:06:29,034 --> 00:06:32,564 And this app is neat because it doesn't require a lot of technical knowledge 126 00:06:32,564 --> 00:06:35,034 to, to make it work and get started. 127 00:06:35,134 --> 00:06:37,774 Yeah, it's on the back end where you then toss it into the map. 128 00:06:37,774 --> 00:06:42,354 You're just chatting and grabbing points as you're going through otherwise. 129 00:06:43,959 --> 00:06:49,129 And of course, with the recent intrusion into the RCS and SMS, was, was it RCS 130 00:06:49,639 --> 00:06:51,929 as well as SMS that China hacked into? 131 00:06:51,959 --> 00:06:52,399 Either way. 132 00:06:54,159 --> 00:07:00,959 Countries have been hacking into various non encrypted data technologies. 133 00:07:00,969 --> 00:07:05,579 And so, since this one is encrypted in theory, you're kind of safe, I guess. 134 00:07:06,079 --> 00:07:08,639 Does anyone here use WhatsApp besides me? 135 00:07:08,989 --> 00:07:09,639 I use it. 136 00:07:09,869 --> 00:07:10,349 Really? 137 00:07:10,799 --> 00:07:13,539 I use it because when I work with international students and 138 00:07:13,539 --> 00:07:15,029 professionals, it's what they use. 139 00:07:15,299 --> 00:07:16,269 It's what they're used to. 140 00:07:16,719 --> 00:07:18,289 We use it when we're on trips. 141 00:07:18,739 --> 00:07:19,979 Yes, sporadically. 142 00:07:20,419 --> 00:07:20,759 Hmm. 143 00:07:21,429 --> 00:07:23,969 It, literally the only thing I use it for is a group a 144 00:07:23,969 --> 00:07:25,394 guitar group that I play with. 145 00:07:25,854 --> 00:07:27,614 follow they use it for communication. 146 00:07:27,654 --> 00:07:27,944 So. 147 00:07:29,014 --> 00:07:29,754 Go out and check it out. 148 00:07:31,104 --> 00:07:31,454 Okay. 149 00:07:31,474 --> 00:07:35,834 So this week I just, I was, I just want to bring up some questions 150 00:07:35,834 --> 00:07:36,704 and see what people think. 151 00:07:36,724 --> 00:07:40,154 Cause they're literally what I titled the topic this week is discussion 152 00:07:40,164 --> 00:07:41,924 around questions Jesse had this week. 153 00:07:42,614 --> 00:07:42,784 Yes. 154 00:07:42,904 --> 00:07:45,204 As we, as we roll towards the end of the year, it's not like a year 155 00:07:45,204 --> 00:07:46,344 end thing, but it just so happens. 156 00:07:46,354 --> 00:07:49,054 No, no, I have questions that I want other people to, to. 157 00:07:49,449 --> 00:07:52,999 Give me their take on Not not a year end type of thing. 158 00:07:53,029 --> 00:07:54,349 That's that's for the next episode. 159 00:07:54,349 --> 00:08:01,589 Yes And and so the first one just heard about this today and it's tied to so Tim 160 00:08:01,589 --> 00:08:08,069 Johnson the longtime Well many different positions, but eventually director of 161 00:08:08,079 --> 00:08:13,459 the North Carolina GIS NCGIA and then maybe even now as he's retiring, the 162 00:08:13,459 --> 00:08:17,229 director of all of IT in North Carolina, I can't remember but he's retiring. 163 00:08:17,229 --> 00:08:21,939 So congratulations for many, many years decades really on working with 164 00:08:21,939 --> 00:08:23,679 GIS, especially within North Carolina. 165 00:08:23,699 --> 00:08:24,809 So congrats. 166 00:08:25,259 --> 00:08:28,809 But one of the things he's going to be doing is stepping away to be part of 167 00:08:28,849 --> 00:08:32,974 the National Geospatial Collaborative, which I had Not heard of before and 168 00:08:32,974 --> 00:08:36,964 this is something that's coming out of the National Geospatial National 169 00:08:36,964 --> 00:08:42,724 States Geographic Information Council NISGIC Yeah, but the National Geospatial 170 00:08:42,724 --> 00:08:44,874 Collaborative is a non profit. 171 00:08:44,924 --> 00:08:50,914 That's just kind of starting up really the only place you find it is In 172 00:08:50,914 --> 00:08:55,089 references on the NISGIC webpage so far So has anybody else heard of this? 173 00:08:55,139 --> 00:08:55,969 Know anything about it? 174 00:08:56,419 --> 00:08:57,899 No, is the short answer. 175 00:08:57,909 --> 00:09:03,889 I was actually just thinking of messaging our state GIS coordinator and saying, 176 00:09:04,239 --> 00:09:08,059 because she is the representative for the state of West Virginia to NISJC. 177 00:09:08,149 --> 00:09:09,019 Do you know about this? 178 00:09:09,019 --> 00:09:09,659 What is this thing? 179 00:09:11,209 --> 00:09:13,409 And so it's, it's, it's just kind of curious. 180 00:09:13,429 --> 00:09:18,439 If you go to, and I think right now one of the, the big names in East Coast 181 00:09:18,499 --> 00:09:24,189 GIS people, Bill Johnson geography and GIS really is currently, I think, at 182 00:09:24,189 --> 00:09:27,639 least a board member, if he's not the person who's kind of chairing it right 183 00:09:27,639 --> 00:09:30,600 now and he had a post on LinkedIn. 184 00:09:31,100 --> 00:09:31,880 Earlier this year. 185 00:09:32,300 --> 00:09:33,970 So really it's only been around for a couple of years. 186 00:09:33,970 --> 00:09:37,330 I think they announced it in 22, 23, somewhere in there. 187 00:09:37,830 --> 00:09:41,139 But they came up with a mission statement, vision statement, 188 00:09:41,140 --> 00:09:46,070 sorry, of to boldly pursue a more effective geospatial ecosystem. 189 00:09:46,289 --> 00:09:51,320 I, it's just a little tantalizing morsel that I want to know more about now 190 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:53,500 and what they're, what they're doing. 191 00:09:53,500 --> 00:09:58,175 And, you know, as a nonprofit, a new nonprofit, It's you know, not like 192 00:09:58,175 --> 00:10:02,665 they have a lot of wherewithal to do a lot of stuff So i'm not surprised that 193 00:10:02,665 --> 00:10:06,545 there's not a lot of information out there But it just I want to know more 194 00:10:06,655 --> 00:10:09,104 and I just wanted to see if anybody else had heard anything about it before 195 00:10:09,594 --> 00:10:12,855 Yeah, i'm just excited about it because I was just thinking about this when 196 00:10:12,855 --> 00:10:17,195 I was looking for some things for our state association that you know in other 197 00:10:17,195 --> 00:10:21,475 industries that come from like solid waste we have A lot of groups we can go 198 00:10:21,475 --> 00:10:27,175 to for information and support That's just more centralized and I felt like, 199 00:10:27,185 --> 00:10:30,775 you know, we have all these things that go on, but they're not so centralized. 200 00:10:30,775 --> 00:10:34,614 There's not one hub that covers everything for you know, just our 201 00:10:34,614 --> 00:10:36,974 whole community, everybody in it. 202 00:10:37,354 --> 00:10:40,684 And I feel like this might be the answer to that, of where do 203 00:10:40,684 --> 00:10:46,024 I go to get information on things that affect everybody within 204 00:10:46,034 --> 00:10:48,364 the geospatial sphere in the U. 205 00:10:48,364 --> 00:10:48,534 S. 206 00:10:48,544 --> 00:10:49,174 especially. 207 00:10:49,424 --> 00:10:50,134 Yeah, we don't know. 208 00:10:50,144 --> 00:10:52,304 We don't know what they're doing yet. 209 00:10:52,739 --> 00:10:53,799 Yeah, I mean, I have both. 210 00:10:53,829 --> 00:10:58,559 I think both potentially something really good, but also I do have some 211 00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:02,819 questions because it seems that, at least initially, it's not going to be one 212 00:11:02,819 --> 00:11:04,459 that right, you know, people can join. 213 00:11:04,459 --> 00:11:09,539 It's going to be a collaborative of organizations, and so there's going 214 00:11:09,539 --> 00:11:13,489 to be that extra layer in between, and sometimes, you know, you get, 215 00:11:13,539 --> 00:11:17,029 you get issues that maybe as a, as a group, somebody really wants to 216 00:11:17,029 --> 00:11:20,999 push, but it doesn't necessarily mean that it will trickle down. 217 00:11:21,614 --> 00:11:23,104 To sort of individual people. 218 00:11:23,104 --> 00:11:27,174 And the idea, right, to boldly pursue a more effective geospatial 219 00:11:27,214 --> 00:11:31,054 ecosystem, I think, I guess, broadly, absolutely agree with that. 220 00:11:31,055 --> 00:11:34,544 But, but again, I mean, and early on, as, as noted, they don't really 221 00:11:34,584 --> 00:11:36,604 have definition for what that means. 222 00:11:37,264 --> 00:11:41,664 But the stakeholders, including academia private sector, public agencies, right, 223 00:11:41,664 --> 00:11:47,029 so many people who utilize geospatial technologies, I think that there are, as 224 00:11:47,039 --> 00:11:51,929 pointed out, lots of, lots of gaps in how things work, and if we wish, you know, 225 00:11:52,099 --> 00:11:53,199 different parts could work together. 226 00:11:53,199 --> 00:11:56,729 I, because kind of being selfish and thinking about the academia, 227 00:11:57,069 --> 00:12:01,919 academia sector, right, we're often very disconnected, some of us, from 228 00:12:02,309 --> 00:12:07,139 what is actually needed and happening in some, say, the private sector. 229 00:12:07,159 --> 00:12:11,229 I mean, you know, we keep up and what's not, but sometimes it's like, well, 230 00:12:12,624 --> 00:12:17,624 It's not an understanding of how our wheels move timeline wise versus, say, 231 00:12:17,624 --> 00:12:18,644 somebody out in the private sector. 232 00:12:18,644 --> 00:12:26,914 So some of those things, it'd be nice to have a sort of broader network feedback 233 00:12:26,914 --> 00:12:28,254 loop, I guess, is what I'm thinking. 234 00:12:28,264 --> 00:12:30,854 Okay, like this thing called the Geospatial Professional Network. 235 00:12:31,065 --> 00:12:34,384 So anyway, so that's my like, you know, just off the cuff initial thoughts, 236 00:12:34,394 --> 00:12:35,874 because I also was not familiar. 237 00:12:36,574 --> 00:12:38,514 Okay, question number two for this week. 238 00:12:39,174 --> 00:12:40,174 OSM went down. 239 00:12:41,004 --> 00:12:45,634 What what I mean, it was very quick to get back up in terms of 240 00:12:46,324 --> 00:12:49,004 Read only, I think it may still I didn't check right before we did it. 241 00:12:49,004 --> 00:12:54,574 But earlier today it was still read only They were already apparently working to 242 00:12:55,454 --> 00:12:58,674 You know steady their their infrastructure and this just happened to happen 243 00:12:59,144 --> 00:13:03,834 right when they were about to Do that. 244 00:13:04,024 --> 00:13:07,624 So it's just horrible timing, but I don't know thoughts. 245 00:13:07,684 --> 00:13:10,174 I mean, to me, OSM is infrastructural. 246 00:13:10,949 --> 00:13:11,619 At this point 247 00:13:12,099 --> 00:13:17,399 and yeah when I saw that I was thinking This is why they are considered a 248 00:13:17,399 --> 00:13:21,689 digital public good you know to you know to provide support because so 249 00:13:21,689 --> 00:13:25,559 many people rely on them to hopefully Steady things like this that might 250 00:13:25,559 --> 00:13:29,399 happen because like you when it went down I was like, okay What happens 251 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:33,909 when they go down and so many people rely on on that them for infrastructure 252 00:13:34,149 --> 00:13:37,894 now to be fair a lot of people Have cloned Theirs. 253 00:13:37,894 --> 00:13:41,694 And so they're running their own instance for their, their businesses and stuff. 254 00:13:41,694 --> 00:13:46,484 So it's not like their site going down, took down most of the mapping 255 00:13:46,484 --> 00:13:48,194 applications that exist out there. 256 00:13:48,444 --> 00:13:52,684 It could have if people weren't cloning you know, it regularly and 257 00:13:52,684 --> 00:13:53,864 keeping their own version of it. 258 00:13:53,894 --> 00:13:59,904 But still, it's a, it's a massive impact whenever you think about just how many 259 00:14:00,484 --> 00:14:07,105 sites, apps Researchers et cetera, rely on OpenStreetMap for, for a data source. 260 00:14:07,870 --> 00:14:10,730 And also, I think a reminder too, not just for that, right, we've periodically 261 00:14:10,980 --> 00:14:13,810 over the many years of various spatial, right, talked about this and gone 262 00:14:13,810 --> 00:14:18,700 back and forth is that we forget sometimes that, that there's always 263 00:14:18,700 --> 00:14:22,150 like a physical infrastructure, right? 264 00:14:22,150 --> 00:14:24,340 Robert used the word infrastructure and you'd use the word infrastructure, 265 00:14:24,340 --> 00:14:27,590 but there's a physical structure behind all this stuff and we, we 266 00:14:27,590 --> 00:14:29,340 forget it until something goes wrong. 267 00:14:29,340 --> 00:14:33,260 So it isn't, isn't just this and also that somebody has to bear 268 00:14:33,260 --> 00:14:34,640 the cost and the time for that. 269 00:14:35,825 --> 00:14:36,875 And the maintenance, right? 270 00:14:36,885 --> 00:14:40,115 Even, even, you know, think about it, even our podcast, right? 271 00:14:40,875 --> 00:14:45,555 Jesse has to maintain a service where we put the podcast. 272 00:14:45,585 --> 00:14:48,305 There's physical things we have to do, right, when we 273 00:14:48,305 --> 00:14:49,585 connect to chat with everybody. 274 00:14:49,885 --> 00:14:52,795 And, and sometimes we forget those things, but when you writ, when that's 275 00:14:52,805 --> 00:14:56,695 writ large, at, you know, something like OpenStreetMap that has been around 276 00:14:56,695 --> 00:15:00,425 as long as it has that serves so many places, right, still at the end of 277 00:15:00,425 --> 00:15:05,630 the day, Those digital resources are connected to some physical space where 278 00:15:05,630 --> 00:15:10,200 they have to live and, and sometimes we forget that and how much it, how much it 279 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:14,560 costs to maintain it, not just in money, but also in all these other things. 280 00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:20,740 And without, sometimes without the support that maybe we knew we wish 281 00:15:20,740 --> 00:15:25,330 we had for these things, right, they're going to go away, potentially. 282 00:15:25,820 --> 00:15:28,480 All it takes is one ISP's router to go down. 283 00:15:28,580 --> 00:15:30,490 Well, and in this case, right, this is a short term thing. 284 00:15:30,490 --> 00:15:32,850 But I mean, just long term, there have to be people, and you talked 285 00:15:32,860 --> 00:15:34,030 about everybody cloning it, right? 286 00:15:34,030 --> 00:15:39,050 There have to be people then who are willing to commit their resources to 287 00:15:39,050 --> 00:15:42,000 propagating it, you know, through the clones and then serving that up there. 288 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,030 And it's great, and it's a great community, but it, but 289 00:15:45,030 --> 00:15:47,420 it has to have this commitment. 290 00:15:47,530 --> 00:15:48,650 And it's just one example, right? 291 00:15:48,650 --> 00:15:49,399 Well, but that's the problem, right, 292 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:52,854 is that, that I don't, there clearly is not, there clearly isn't. 293 00:15:53,015 --> 00:15:56,725 A secondary instance that somebody else is running that it's that it's 294 00:15:56,725 --> 00:16:00,115 able to fail back over to they they're cloning it for their own purposes, but 295 00:16:00,135 --> 00:16:06,085 nobody is supporting a duplicate site somewhere like we would expect to see 296 00:16:06,525 --> 00:16:09,625 from lots of, you know, years of open source downloads and those type of 297 00:16:09,625 --> 00:16:13,935 things that this open access data gets dealt with a little bit differently. 298 00:16:14,435 --> 00:16:15,145 So. 299 00:16:17,475 --> 00:16:20,755 This this I'm trying to articulate this so pardon me. 300 00:16:22,045 --> 00:16:22,505 So what? 301 00:16:22,535 --> 00:16:24,955 That was just, that was my reaction, to be honest with you. 302 00:16:24,955 --> 00:16:26,345 It was, OpenStreetMap is down. 303 00:16:26,355 --> 00:16:26,775 So what? 304 00:16:26,785 --> 00:16:30,065 Microsoft's been down before, and, and, USGS has been down 305 00:16:30,065 --> 00:16:33,565 before, and the National Map used to go down all the damn time. 306 00:16:33,875 --> 00:16:34,355 So, 307 00:16:35,175 --> 00:16:39,325 But each of those examples have the money to make it happen to come back up. 308 00:16:40,665 --> 00:16:41,025 Yeah. 309 00:16:41,045 --> 00:16:44,895 Well, but it's it's the it's part of the internet, right? 310 00:16:44,945 --> 00:16:50,515 I mean just things go down sometimes so like it didn't it didn't really phase 311 00:16:50,755 --> 00:16:52,585 when I heard oh open street maps down. 312 00:16:52,865 --> 00:16:54,725 So They'll get back online. 313 00:16:54,725 --> 00:16:55,125 It'll happen. 314 00:16:55,125 --> 00:17:00,485 Yeah, that's not the question So it's just part of the modern world these 315 00:17:00,495 --> 00:17:03,935 things, you know, just like your power goes out occasionally it just does 316 00:17:03,935 --> 00:17:09,250 You so I, this bothered me a lot less than it seemed to bother other people. 317 00:17:09,360 --> 00:17:12,590 You know, not just what we've been talking about here, but I saw on the 318 00:17:12,590 --> 00:17:14,160 internet, people were freaking out a lot. 319 00:17:14,170 --> 00:17:17,020 And I thought, well, haven't you, you know, lost Tik TOK occasionally 320 00:17:17,020 --> 00:17:20,900 or Reddit or whatever, you know, thing it is that your thing is, it 321 00:17:20,900 --> 00:17:22,050 just doesn't work for some reason. 322 00:17:22,580 --> 00:17:26,890 It's just, you know, part of the, part of the world we live in. 323 00:17:27,820 --> 00:17:28,640 It is true. 324 00:17:29,180 --> 00:17:34,795 But if we can kind of encourage people to maybe, you know, Give a little to a non 325 00:17:34,795 --> 00:17:36,625 profit that A lot of people are utilizing. 326 00:17:37,355 --> 00:17:37,905 Why not? 327 00:17:38,195 --> 00:17:38,445 Yeah. 328 00:17:38,445 --> 00:17:39,345 I mean, definitely do that. 329 00:17:39,365 --> 00:17:41,895 Irrespective of the fact that it went down, I mean, do that anyway. 330 00:17:41,895 --> 00:17:46,585 It's, it's an important service that's available, but even if you get money, 331 00:17:47,085 --> 00:17:49,975 I guess the flip side of that would be, even if you gave money to help 332 00:17:50,305 --> 00:17:52,965 in these types of situations, it's still going to go down eventually. 333 00:17:53,115 --> 00:17:53,775 It just will. 334 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,400 But if there's a backup server somewhere on the other side of the 335 00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:59,350 planet, that there's a failover to then it takes care of it. 336 00:17:59,780 --> 00:18:07,680 Well, hopefully, I mean, you know, I've certainly had in my minute example where 337 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:09,360 I had a failover and it was working fine. 338 00:18:09,370 --> 00:18:11,610 And then it didn't whenever I had a crisis. 339 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:12,820 I don't know why. 340 00:18:13,130 --> 00:18:19,240 So it's just Give money to this organization, help them make the 341 00:18:19,270 --> 00:18:21,540 more resilient, but understand it's never gonna be perfect. 342 00:18:21,580 --> 00:18:21,980 So 343 00:18:22,570 --> 00:18:26,840 I will move on to, so drone news impact, right? 344 00:18:26,850 --> 00:18:30,600 This is based really on, on Barb sending a Reddit. 345 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:36,060 Well, it was just funny because in, in that post, the it was just, it's 346 00:18:36,060 --> 00:18:39,040 a normal forum where they talk about drones for people that are within 347 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:42,990 the profession and they, they shut it down because they were getting so many 348 00:18:42,990 --> 00:18:46,090 people that were coming there that didn't understand drone technology 349 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:48,460 based on what was going on in the news. 350 00:18:48,490 --> 00:18:51,590 And they basically were like, wait, we can't handle all these questions. 351 00:18:52,030 --> 00:18:54,230 And you don't understand what drones are. 352 00:18:54,230 --> 00:18:55,510 You don't understand what. 353 00:18:55,950 --> 00:19:00,410 You know, things are in terms of, you know, remote earth observation. 354 00:19:00,770 --> 00:19:05,380 So I just thought it was very interesting because again, our profession tends 355 00:19:05,380 --> 00:19:10,430 to be very not hidden, but we're an iceberg and what people see are the. 356 00:19:10,900 --> 00:19:14,150 Outputs of what we do, but they don't see the technology side. 357 00:19:14,410 --> 00:19:19,280 So in this case what you were seeing in this, the news were reports that people 358 00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:23,970 were seeing normal drones, very different types of drones than they are used to. 359 00:19:24,260 --> 00:19:27,880 Because some of them might be, you know, industry based or hobbyist. 360 00:19:28,190 --> 00:19:32,480 But also in some cases they were aircraft or unmanned aircraft. 361 00:19:32,770 --> 00:19:34,600 In some cases, constellations. 362 00:19:35,150 --> 00:19:36,380 Not constellations. 363 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:40,670 of drones, which do exist, just star constellations. 364 00:19:40,940 --> 00:19:44,830 Again, not understanding, you know, Earth observation. 365 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:50,050 But for me, what was funny is I have a different perspective because 366 00:19:50,070 --> 00:19:53,460 being from New Jersey in school, we learn about War of the Worlds. 367 00:19:54,385 --> 00:19:55,605 And this felt very similar. 368 00:19:55,875 --> 00:20:01,015 So, for me, the, the thing that it kind of comes from is I, you know, we 369 00:20:01,015 --> 00:20:07,195 all saw the news items about this, and every time one popped up, I'm like, 370 00:20:07,215 --> 00:20:13,295 okay, so why has nobody just done, one, a check for, cause, Everybody 371 00:20:13,305 --> 00:20:16,155 has to tie to part 89 of part 107. 372 00:20:16,185 --> 00:20:18,995 Oh wait part 89 isn't part of 107. 373 00:20:19,315 --> 00:20:26,615 Never mind, but Part 89 you have to have remote id on your drones now So just get 374 00:20:26,615 --> 00:20:30,245 somebody out there who has an appropriate app, which there's only like two apps. 375 00:20:30,255 --> 00:20:34,045 So whatever and and check to see who's there and flying it 376 00:20:34,065 --> 00:20:37,125 because They are flying legally. 377 00:20:37,165 --> 00:20:38,815 They are lit appropriately. 378 00:20:38,835 --> 00:20:45,965 They are at appropriate elevations so They most likely are flying legally 379 00:20:45,965 --> 00:20:52,005 and so have remote ID turned on and it's also possible they have a waiver. 380 00:20:52,155 --> 00:20:58,795 So just look at the FAA waiver list, which is a public document to see if 381 00:20:58,795 --> 00:21:00,215 there's any waivers in those areas. 382 00:21:00,595 --> 00:21:03,045 Now, of course, more recently with all the other ones popping up in 383 00:21:03,045 --> 00:21:06,755 various places, I'm assuming those are copycats to take advantage of the 384 00:21:07,705 --> 00:21:10,045 fanaticism tied to the New Jersey ones. 385 00:21:10,595 --> 00:21:14,295 But it's probably a company that just is flying legally is my expectation. 386 00:21:14,845 --> 00:21:15,325 And just. 387 00:21:15,690 --> 00:21:18,350 Nobody wants to be that company that's like, yeah, we're the ones 388 00:21:18,350 --> 00:21:19,580 who are legally causing this. 389 00:21:19,850 --> 00:21:22,380 These people to freak out, but we don't know why they're freaking out 390 00:21:23,610 --> 00:21:28,910 the, the concern I had here was the negative press around drones 391 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:32,910 the presumption that all of this was nefarious by definition, if 392 00:21:32,910 --> 00:21:34,580 it's drones, it must be nefarious. 393 00:21:34,580 --> 00:21:37,510 That was sort of the tenor of the news coverage. 394 00:21:37,890 --> 00:21:37,910 Yeah. 395 00:21:38,195 --> 00:21:40,785 It, you know, like Jesse said, we can figure out who was doing it. 396 00:21:40,835 --> 00:21:45,365 And we could probably figure out why they were doing it without too much 397 00:21:45,365 --> 00:21:51,115 trouble, but really just that default presumption that thing in sky bad. 398 00:21:51,605 --> 00:21:55,255 That was very disheartening for me. 399 00:21:55,585 --> 00:21:56,565 Since I think that. 400 00:21:56,865 --> 00:22:00,345 This is a technology that we need to get a little more comfortable with as a 401 00:22:00,345 --> 00:22:07,565 people that it's it's not always a bad thing it's a useful technology it could 402 00:22:07,575 --> 00:22:11,325 actually make your life a lot better as long as everyone follows the rules 403 00:22:11,425 --> 00:22:16,075 right and that was a very upsetting. 404 00:22:16,610 --> 00:22:23,020 Turn in the, the conversation, but in the news particularly considering that 405 00:22:23,050 --> 00:22:26,190 an awful lot of the people, I don't know, does not get too political, 406 00:22:26,190 --> 00:22:31,150 but an awful lot of people that were having issues with it tend to support. 407 00:22:32,110 --> 00:22:34,680 Agencies that tend to utilize this technology. 408 00:22:35,380 --> 00:22:38,840 That's an over, I'm trying to not say something political, but it 409 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:40,650 just was a really weird thing. 410 00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:44,030 And I'm not sure how we as an industry. 411 00:22:45,230 --> 00:22:51,090 Address these technologies that we use in such a way to avoid the surveillance 412 00:22:51,100 --> 00:22:54,600 state judgment that goes back to the G. 413 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:54,610 I. 414 00:22:54,610 --> 00:22:54,760 S. 415 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,280 and society debates, but from a different angle 416 00:22:58,710 --> 00:23:00,890 and you know, along with what Frank was saying. 417 00:23:00,890 --> 00:23:05,319 I also wondered if because I think the technology is Yeah. 418 00:23:05,580 --> 00:23:10,850 A lot more progressed, you know, than what people normally who don't work 419 00:23:10,850 --> 00:23:14,240 in the field, think of it as if they would have thought differently, if 420 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:17,520 they were able to see them in the daylight, like, would this have been 421 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:21,000 different if they were, were flying during the day rather than at night? 422 00:23:21,540 --> 00:23:24,050 Well, I think Frank, like Frank was saying during the day, they 423 00:23:24,050 --> 00:23:24,950 probably wouldn't even see them. 424 00:23:25,660 --> 00:23:32,160 It's just the fact that at night as part of 107, you do have to have 425 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:34,280 lights that are visible within three. 426 00:23:34,825 --> 00:23:36,275 Miles, statute miles. 427 00:23:37,135 --> 00:23:38,705 So, you know, they're bright. 428 00:23:38,905 --> 00:23:43,575 They're, they're just kind of, you, you have to be able to see 429 00:23:43,575 --> 00:23:46,345 them so that planes don't run into them or helicopters and others. 430 00:23:46,345 --> 00:23:50,105 So, yeah, it's, I think you're right that, you know, in the daytime, it would 431 00:23:50,105 --> 00:23:51,585 have just not been an issue at all. 432 00:23:51,915 --> 00:23:55,475 And Frank heard me saying over and over, I'm going to be so irritated if this is 433 00:23:55,475 --> 00:24:01,965 a publicity stunt for a company or just a plain old hoax that's gone on too long. 434 00:24:01,965 --> 00:24:02,025 Yeah. 435 00:24:03,530 --> 00:24:07,540 Well, and, you know, I think that's where we're getting now because we have other 436 00:24:07,570 --> 00:24:11,870 examples and now Southern California, North Carolina somewhere else in the 437 00:24:11,870 --> 00:24:14,720 Northeast that have been called out. 438 00:24:14,730 --> 00:24:17,450 And of course, then you have all the people who are like you were 439 00:24:17,450 --> 00:24:19,110 saying, who are calling out. 440 00:24:19,935 --> 00:24:21,505 Stars as well. 441 00:24:21,505 --> 00:24:22,165 Is that a drone? 442 00:24:22,185 --> 00:24:23,145 No, it's just a star. 443 00:24:23,155 --> 00:24:24,115 It's been there a long 444 00:24:24,335 --> 00:24:28,215 it's just and it's a that's a plane And that's a helicopter. 445 00:24:28,485 --> 00:24:29,715 It's just like calm down. 446 00:24:30,005 --> 00:24:32,795 This has been wrong your entire life Relax 447 00:24:33,275 --> 00:24:37,215 Yeah, I think that's that was my initial reaction like calm down We 448 00:24:37,215 --> 00:24:40,445 went from news and then to say like the change in media coverage too, right? 449 00:24:40,695 --> 00:24:43,995 We went from news articles about drone delivery and all kinds 450 00:24:43,995 --> 00:24:48,305 of stuff, you know drones being used to to Things into disaster. 451 00:24:48,305 --> 00:24:51,485 I mean, like all of these types of things about using drones and stuff 452 00:24:51,485 --> 00:24:55,175 to, to this being, and it's just, it feels like a step backwards. 453 00:24:56,035 --> 00:24:56,795 It just really does. 454 00:24:57,195 --> 00:25:01,035 And my final question this, this week, and I think this is the one that is the, 455 00:25:01,045 --> 00:25:05,575 the biggest question mark left hanging is, are we nearing the end of the Arab Spring 456 00:25:06,305 --> 00:25:09,265 after 14 years as of this month, I think? 457 00:25:10,185 --> 00:25:12,245 We're, we're, we're seeing with Syria. 458 00:25:12,915 --> 00:25:14,155 Well, it depends on what you mean by end. 459 00:25:14,155 --> 00:25:15,735 I think they would think it would be there. 460 00:25:15,915 --> 00:25:19,165 It would be their spring, to be honest. 461 00:25:19,915 --> 00:25:21,805 That they want, that they would have a separate spring. 462 00:25:21,995 --> 00:25:22,305 Yeah. 463 00:25:22,355 --> 00:25:23,045 In this case, fall. 464 00:25:23,055 --> 00:25:25,335 In this case, I mean, like it depends what you mean by end. 465 00:25:25,345 --> 00:25:26,315 I mean, the end of the. 466 00:25:26,950 --> 00:25:30,120 Of the tide that created it. 467 00:25:30,210 --> 00:25:34,550 Yeah, well, I mean, you know, everything starts in Tunisia in late 2010. 468 00:25:35,030 --> 00:25:41,020 And we talk about how things happen very quickly in places like Yemen and Egypt 469 00:25:41,020 --> 00:25:44,030 and other various countries in the region. 470 00:25:44,540 --> 00:25:47,680 And things start in Syria in 2011. 471 00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:53,970 But they've, because of ISIS and various interactions and all these 472 00:25:53,970 --> 00:26:00,020 different things, it has kind of been a simmering pot for the last 14 years. 473 00:26:00,530 --> 00:26:08,040 And so is this, you know, can we, we don't know what's going to happen now, but is 474 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:13,590 this something that is still part of the Arab Spring or is it now a new day that 475 00:26:14,790 --> 00:26:20,900 hasn't, that we don't tie to the last 14 years of on again, off again, rebellions. 476 00:26:21,485 --> 00:26:24,995 So when I read this question, Jesse, from you, I thought it had to do 477 00:26:24,995 --> 00:26:29,275 with social media and location based apps that made the, this possible. 478 00:26:29,795 --> 00:26:34,005 And, you know, again, at the time it was more everyone in one place. 479 00:26:34,055 --> 00:26:37,965 And now that everyone worldwide is sort of, you know, You know, there's 480 00:26:37,975 --> 00:26:42,255 many different platforms that you could be on that that's what I was 481 00:26:42,275 --> 00:26:46,255 taking as your, your ending of, you know, if you don't have one location 482 00:26:46,255 --> 00:26:50,595 where people gather then, you know, is, is something like that possible? 483 00:26:51,775 --> 00:26:55,012 So, that's how I was reading it when, when I saw that discussion. 484 00:26:55,012 --> 00:26:58,065 Going back to WhatsApp and things like that, it makes it more possible because 485 00:26:58,085 --> 00:27:04,295 now we have channels that are harder to be shut down by governments like they did 486 00:27:04,295 --> 00:27:08,775 in the Arab Spring movement, especially in places like Egypt and other places 487 00:27:09,175 --> 00:27:10,855 where they just shut down the internet. 488 00:27:11,540 --> 00:27:14,480 Which, of course, they very quickly turned that off so that business 489 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:17,720 could go back to, so they didn't just cripple their entire economy. 490 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,360 But, okay, so I'm the one who kind of thought that. 491 00:27:20,370 --> 00:27:23,020 Well, no, I don't think that that, I just think it's a much more complex 492 00:27:23,070 --> 00:27:27,720 question that, that I would think on more before I would comment on just 493 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:30,650 because of the just deep implications of. 494 00:27:30,660 --> 00:27:33,010 Well, like I said, whenever I started this one, it's like one 495 00:27:33,010 --> 00:27:35,160 that, Is it really answerable? 496 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:41,440 My take is a bit radical, which is, did we ever have an Arab spring? 497 00:27:41,930 --> 00:27:46,780 And I know that we think about a particular period of time for a particular 498 00:27:47,290 --> 00:27:52,510 set of responses to stimuli as, Oh, this is a change, the Arab spring. 499 00:27:52,510 --> 00:27:54,480 This is a I was going to say radical departure. 500 00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:58,410 But I mean, that's a little strong, a significant departure from the past. 501 00:27:58,460 --> 00:27:59,000 But if you. 502 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:05,310 You know, follow this history back, certainly 50 years did the modern 503 00:28:05,310 --> 00:28:09,230 history post World War II to keep it even, you know, further back, 504 00:28:09,790 --> 00:28:12,810 these undulations are not unusual. 505 00:28:13,570 --> 00:28:17,180 No, maybe that's not the word they have have happened significantly. 506 00:28:17,360 --> 00:28:25,975 And my feeling is, is that the Arab spring as a construct is a little bit Western 507 00:28:25,975 --> 00:28:32,385 derived, we wanted to signify something momentously changing in this region. 508 00:28:32,925 --> 00:28:37,745 And I think to Sue's point, it's very complicated and understanding 509 00:28:37,745 --> 00:28:39,775 what's going on there is really hard. 510 00:28:39,815 --> 00:28:43,515 I studied this as part of one of my degrees, and I would never pretend to 511 00:28:43,515 --> 00:28:45,175 even be able to touch the surface of it. 512 00:28:45,205 --> 00:28:50,005 Other than to say that there was a lot of exciting things happening, you know, 513 00:28:50,045 --> 00:28:52,185 10 to 12 years ago in that region. 514 00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:58,670 And I think that we got a lot of excitement from the West and 515 00:28:59,020 --> 00:29:06,050 the reality has been much more complicated and less clear cut. 516 00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:09,760 And I think that maybe it's the end of the Arab spring in the sense of maybe 517 00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:11,730 the West is finally understanding that. 518 00:29:12,015 --> 00:29:18,075 These things are going to be micro changes over generations, maybe before 519 00:29:18,575 --> 00:29:21,115 it's a true evolution of this stuff. 520 00:29:21,515 --> 00:29:24,665 So that was my thought about that question. 521 00:29:24,665 --> 00:29:28,695 Is it the end of the Arab spring kind of, but only because maybe it's 522 00:29:28,705 --> 00:29:32,785 from a, from a Western perspective, we're realizing, oh, this is not as. 523 00:29:33,990 --> 00:29:38,000 Momentous and clear cut as we hoped it would be 15 years ago 12 years ago 524 00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:42,470 And those are discussions around the questions that I had this week 525 00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,790 just raised and chatted about and to think about right? 526 00:29:46,990 --> 00:29:48,800 Which you know, I think the interesting thing here. 527 00:29:48,910 --> 00:29:57,500 Is You know the topics, that that you thought about were It's really fascinating 528 00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:02,830 Because we went from How do we, you know, organize ourselves as an industry 529 00:30:02,870 --> 00:30:06,740 to technology that underpinned us to how do we talk to the general public 530 00:30:06,750 --> 00:30:10,730 about the technology we use to actually geography, which is remember rear 531 00:30:10,770 --> 00:30:12,730 geospatial, but also geography podcast. 532 00:30:12,730 --> 00:30:14,300 So that's really cool. 533 00:30:14,370 --> 00:30:20,930 I love this sort of scattershot seemingly, but actually has a bit of thought to it. 534 00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:22,260 The conversation we had, 535 00:30:23,170 --> 00:30:25,600 okay, I'm not going to suggest that I had a thought behind it. 536 00:30:25,610 --> 00:30:25,810 So. 537 00:30:26,540 --> 00:30:27,080 Oh, come on. 538 00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:28,830 You did come from my brain. 539 00:30:28,830 --> 00:30:31,770 I will say other than SWIP swapping two things. 540 00:30:31,780 --> 00:30:32,740 So they'd be in a certain order. 541 00:30:32,740 --> 00:30:33,510 There was no thought. 542 00:30:33,910 --> 00:30:36,800 Jesse you could just go and go, you know, why did they use the 543 00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:38,270 term spring after all, right? 544 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,250 Like the Prague spring and all those things. 545 00:30:40,250 --> 00:30:43,460 Like, what is the implication of the term spring as if there is some 546 00:30:43,470 --> 00:30:46,460 outcome that we are expecting, right? 547 00:30:46,460 --> 00:30:49,740 That it's a spring, a dawning, a new growth of some particular 548 00:30:49,740 --> 00:30:52,490 thing that perhaps in Frank with a Western mind, right. 549 00:30:52,490 --> 00:30:53,800 The, that we are expecting. 550 00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:59,320 But we don't take into account what has come before in the different places. 551 00:30:59,470 --> 00:30:59,770 Right. 552 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:02,120 Yeah. 553 00:31:03,820 --> 00:31:06,130 I haven't thought about the Prague Spring since I was in graduate school. 554 00:31:06,150 --> 00:31:06,570 I know. 555 00:31:06,570 --> 00:31:07,760 I was, you brought the Prague Spring. 556 00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:09,510 I was like, actually, that's exactly the point. 557 00:31:09,540 --> 00:31:12,780 Cause the Prague Spring, we're like, we definitely in the, anyway, sorry. 558 00:31:12,870 --> 00:31:13,060 Yeah. 559 00:31:13,060 --> 00:31:14,850 So we had definitely thought sort of what that meant, right. 560 00:31:14,850 --> 00:31:19,190 Is throwing off the yoke of, of totalitarianism and the true return 561 00:31:19,470 --> 00:31:21,912 rising up of, of democratic institutions. 562 00:31:21,912 --> 00:31:25,984 Well we'd have to find the reporter or whoever that 563 00:31:25,984 --> 00:31:28,019 coined the Arab Spring moniker. 564 00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:31,360 To see what they were kind of writing about because, of course, 565 00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:33,840 everybody ran with it in so many different directions that 566 00:31:34,190 --> 00:31:35,710 it's a it's a good question. 567 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:37,520 I thought they were all good questions. 568 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:42,130 I went back to the OSM one just because I was hoping that the people that were 569 00:31:42,130 --> 00:31:47,470 working on that issue are getting a chance to take a break because what I've seen 570 00:31:47,470 --> 00:31:50,960 in the geospatial industry is people on on call, you know, like you said, 571 00:31:50,990 --> 00:31:54,460 we said, keeping that infrastructure growing and they really need to. 572 00:31:54,660 --> 00:31:59,360 step back, take a break, take a vacation after a big, you know, 573 00:31:59,410 --> 00:32:00,660 problem like this comes up. 574 00:32:01,890 --> 00:32:02,190 Yeah. 575 00:32:02,190 --> 00:32:02,910 So, okay. 576 00:32:02,910 --> 00:32:05,890 This is where it comes from Is a political scientist. 577 00:32:05,970 --> 00:32:10,140 This is in wikipedia, which you know critique it all you want But political 578 00:32:10,140 --> 00:32:14,100 scientist mark lynch described arab spring as a term I may have an 579 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:18,620 unintentionally coined on january 6 2011 article for foreign policy magazine. 580 00:32:19,850 --> 00:32:21,240 It's that guy's problem fault 581 00:32:21,250 --> 00:32:22,390 Yeah, there you go 582 00:32:23,730 --> 00:32:26,040 political scientist, man They're always trying to do stuff like that 583 00:32:26,610 --> 00:32:30,550 on the events corner as always go out check out events if you can 584 00:32:31,395 --> 00:32:34,605 GeoWeek is taking place February 10th through the 12th in 585 00:32:34,615 --> 00:32:37,145 Denver, lovely Mile High City. 586 00:32:37,655 --> 00:32:40,644 And GIS Research UK is going to be taking place the 23rd to 587 00:32:40,645 --> 00:32:43,315 the 25th of April in Bristol. 588 00:32:45,500 --> 00:32:47,630 Of course, if you'd like us to add your event to the podcast, send us 589 00:32:47,650 --> 00:32:49,020 an email to podcast at very spatial. 590 00:32:49,070 --> 00:32:49,340 com. 591 00:32:49,860 --> 00:32:52,730 If you'd like to reach us individually, I can be reached at Sue at very spatial. 592 00:32:52,820 --> 00:32:53,140 com. 593 00:32:53,630 --> 00:32:53,980 I can be 594 00:32:53,980 --> 00:32:55,320 reached at Barb at very spatial. 595 00:32:55,470 --> 00:32:55,790 com. 596 00:32:55,950 --> 00:32:57,570 You can reach me at Frank at very spatial. 597 00:32:57,670 --> 00:32:59,790 com and you can follow me on Blue Sky. 598 00:32:59,980 --> 00:33:00,860 I'm on Blue Sky now. 599 00:33:00,910 --> 00:33:03,874 And I actually whatever they call blue skying. 600 00:33:05,185 --> 00:33:05,755 Occasionally. 601 00:33:06,175 --> 00:33:07,115 I'm calling them tweets. 602 00:33:07,125 --> 00:33:07,155 Okay. 603 00:33:07,175 --> 00:33:08,535 Apparently other people call them skeets. 604 00:33:08,565 --> 00:33:09,765 I don't, I don't know what the actual term is. 605 00:33:09,765 --> 00:33:11,285 Yeah, I've heard skeet, which made me laugh. 606 00:33:11,735 --> 00:33:13,605 I heard that too, and I was like, I'm not calling it that. 607 00:33:13,615 --> 00:33:13,935 I'm just not. 608 00:33:13,935 --> 00:33:14,985 Yeah, but I'm not going to do it. 609 00:33:15,065 --> 00:33:15,345 No. 610 00:33:15,835 --> 00:33:18,015 And I'm still just largely just lurking on Blue Sky. 611 00:33:18,475 --> 00:33:20,985 So I'm not going to share my handle yet, because I'm mostly just like 612 00:33:20,985 --> 00:33:21,975 reading other people's stuff. 613 00:33:22,755 --> 00:33:23,685 I haven't been posting. 614 00:33:23,685 --> 00:33:26,155 It's the same as, well, it's shared on the. 615 00:33:27,295 --> 00:33:28,765 Very spatial.com contact, oh, that's, sorry, that's, I 616 00:33:28,765 --> 00:33:29,485 don't have to say it. 617 00:33:29,875 --> 00:33:30,145 Oh, okay. 618 00:33:31,025 --> 00:33:31,475 I'm available. 619 00:33:31,475 --> 00:33:33,605 What kindaspatial and of course, you can find all of our contacts 620 00:33:33,605 --> 00:33:35,835 over at veryspatial.com/contacts. 621 00:33:36,785 --> 00:33:37,325 As always, 622 00:33:38,125 --> 00:33:39,645 we're the folks from VerySpatial. 623 00:33:40,075 --> 00:33:40,675 Thanks for listening, 624 00:33:40,975 --> 00:33:42,715 and we'll see you in a couple weeks 625 00:34:13,735 --> 00:34:14,335 if you want. 626 00:34:37,185 --> 00:34:38,355 I spend some time kicking. 627 00:34:39,585 --> 00:34:39,885 He's 628 00:34:44,165 --> 00:34:47,025 now sleeping against. 629 00:35:30,405 --> 00:35:42,309 I'm sick and if you want to, I'm tired of fighting, fighting the wind. 630 00:35:42,309 --> 00:35:49,524 I'm tired of fighting the wind. 631 00:35:51,705 --> 00:35:54,476 I'm tired of fighting the wind. 632 00:35:54,476 --> 00:35:56,786 Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. 633 00:35:56,786 --> 00:36:00,481 Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh. 634 00:36:00,481 --> 00:36:06,534 I come unglued for you if I wanna. 635 00:36:06,535 --> 00:36:08,845 I'm only asking to play out. 636 00:36:08,845 --> 00:36:12,795 You can choose to give if you wanna. 637 00:36:14,655 --> 00:36:17,635 I'm tired of fighting, fighting the wind. 638 00:36:17,635 --> 00:36:21,674 I'm unglued, unglued. 639 00:36:21,675 --> 00:36:22,184 I come unglued for you.