Unknown: You made it to the final episode of the three part
series where Tia and I do a debrief of my time at vive. By
Vayner. Thanks so much for listening to part one and part
two. Really excited to have this full debrief with Tia and kind
of recap the entire thing. Please make sure to subscribe to
the podcast if you guys haven't already really looking forward
to having some future guests on and still digging into a bit
more of my journey as an entrepreneur. So hope you enjoy
part three. What made you want to participate in Vive, what
were like the big selling points for you with the program?
Yes, initially,
James set up a phone call with me because I did the four DS
session, which is a one day deep dive about your business that me
and Ike went to up in New York, and it was kind of just sold as
like, this is going to be a four DS on steroids, but also we're
going to have
10 other entrepreneurs or C suite executives that are in the
program that you'll be able to learn from and get to, you know,
connect with and network with. And weekly, we're going to bring
in speakers that are experts in all these different industries.
And they kind of asked me, like, what kind of speakers would you
want to have in? And I was like, I don't know. Like, I want to
know more about paid media so they had a paid media person. I
didn't know that. I wanted to know more about a lot of the
things that they brought in which ended up being cool. So
even going into it like, I didn't really have a whole lot
of expectations, because we were the first ever class to do this.
So there was no one to refer to and be like, Hey, did you get a
lot out of it?
But I know how much Gary respects James and also respects
Andrea. And so I was like, if he's willing to put these two
people together to build this program that is this extensive,
and you know, he's putting his name on it, and he's, he
obviously wants it to work. Like,
I just had faith in that it would end up being worthwhile.
And, yeah, the amount of, like, crazy speakers they've had, and
rooms that I've been in with other people that are just, you
know, like, the head of IT marketing for Amazon was at a
party, the head of meta was at a party with us. Like, yeah, it's
just crazy. The you didn't know that going, I didn't know that,
yeah. So the selling point was, like, the unknown, and being the
first Yeah, it was kind of like, we're gonna do a lot for you
guys, because you're taking a risk on us. And
this is kind of what we have in mind. And you know, it's a it's
a hefty price tag, but we know it's going to be worth it. Do
you trust us? Yes or no. And I was kind of like, yeah, I guess,
okay, yeah,
interesting. And what's also really cool is, like, you
mentioned this too, that they kind of did a lot of, like, the
surprise and delight. So it wasn't like they promised you,
because it was the first ever. They weren't, like, saying
you're gonna get this out of it and that out of it. It was,
like, a lot of the stuff was just kind of, oh my gosh, yeah.
And some things changed, like, some speakers couldn't end up
speaking, and they put in different ones, but they were,
they weren't. It was never like, we got a downgraded version.
It's still, like, it was always valuable. Yeah, cool. Obviously,
you followed Gary V for a while now, so his marketing and
content strategy with, like, pushing out content being super
consistent, you followed that. But since doing Vive, how has
your content strategy changed? If it has at all?
Um, I think it changed the most from the four DS thing, because
that's like when I hired Bri like our community manager. But
it's funny, because even in Vive, we didn't talk a whole lot
about organic content strategy, even though that's all that it
seems like Gary talks about, right?
But it definitely has like seeing what the other people are
doing and talking to them about their strategies and doing it
and learning more about that. It definitely in when vive happened
is also when Gary came out with his most recent day trading
attention book, which I listened to the audio version of that I
think
definitely made me look at the content and stuff differently.
And not that I've done it enough myself, but like, I've pushed
Bree to do the memes of the videos and try these different
things, and I did a few green screen videos and, like, just
trying different things. But I'm I'm at the point now where I
think I have enough of, like, backlogged content from doing
podcasts and going to arrival last year, doing four DS, like,
even, like I did some day in the life stuff when we did have
speakers. So like, Yeah, I'm trying to, I'm trying to explore
that more now.
And I really.
Want to just get way ahead with content, where I have like three
posts a day scheduled out for the next, like two weeks, and
then in the next two weeks, create more content so that the
following two weeks has that, you know. So I in my head, I
know what needs to be done, but I haven't necessarily done that
yet.
The whole vibe wasn't necessarily about content, which
is really interesting, but I learned from everyone a little
bit of like, maybe what types of content I should be putting out
or, I mean, even doing the retreat like, made me think
about like content a little bit differently, about, you know,
what? People maybe don't talk about enough in business, and
would be good topics to cover.
So I think
the implementation of all of that stuff is gonna happen
sooner rather than later. So my hope is that now that I've seen
all of these strategies, like in live time, that I can implement
them and see what happens. You know, yeah, a couple things on
that. Is it's funny because like, vive was there wasn't
like, a focus on, like, how to create content to better your
brand, all that stuff, obviously, but it's so funny.
The few times that I did go with you to any like vive events,
people, a lot, some of the others that were there are just
getting content like, so much content, even you like, you're
building content like you guys are wanting to share. And it's
just, it's funny that he's like, kind of curated this like
culture amongst the people who are business owners and
operators like that. It's so important to like show, like the
personality and like the real human interaction behind like
these brands. So yeah, I feel like even though that wasn't
like, something that they touched on. I mean, what's a
really cool thing? And it wasn't like, taught to you directly,
like, hey, you need to have a team of people following you and
recording. Tell me how many times you've went to a Vive or
Gary V thing where he has a literal crew of people filming
at all. We went to Gary V people just always film me. Not even
that. We went to the Vayner offices in California. Yeah,
there are people walking around with, like, cameras and like
their phones, and everyone is just getting content all day
every day. Yeah, they're just used to it. So why do you think
that's so important for that company culture? Because they're
constantly sending putting out media, like, yeah. I mean,
that's, uh, people care a lot about the the behind the scenes,
yeah, the, not necessarily behind the scenes, but like, who
the people are that work for the business and who the leader is
behind the business. Like, like prime Logan Paul's brand, for
example, is built on Logan Paul. It's not built on the drink
being a good drink. And no one thinks of VaynerMedia, yeah,
yeah. Like, people think of Gary V but he has a huge business
that's people care a lot about the people that work for
businesses nowadays. They want to work with a person, a human
that they know about and have learned about, you know. And so
I think that's just kind of what they've created. And if you, if
you really want to put out three pieces of content a day on every
platform, you have to be capturing a bunch and then just
condensing that, you know, or else, one day content, you can
get a month worth of content, yeah, if you do it right, yeah?
Jesus, yeah. No. It was wild seeing how many people had it
was like cameramen, and it wasn't like a crew. It was like,
just people individual cameras who have, like, I'm so used to
seeing you, like walking around when we're doing hikes, or any
like, of our instructor, like, your camera gear. It was like
that time. And I'm like, if Justin didn't go down this
career path that like you've gone down, I'm like, I could, so
see you doing something like that. Oh, yeah, I would love
doing that. So even I like, I could, so see it, yeah. So it's
funny that even though you didn't, like, get schooled on
content directly, it was so surrounding you and like all
aspects, that it's like, how are you not inspired? Or, like,
taking mental notes along the way. Because I feel like
they were preaching about content sometimes, like, yeah,
yeah, yeah. But they, I mean, they didn't sell us on, like,
we're gonna teach you how to do content. Was it just so happened
that, like, when we would go to the, like, the the Vayner
offices, they had tiktokers there that were talking about
their strategies with content, and we were just there at the at
that time. It was right place, right time, yeah, well, it was
also because Gary came out with a book at the same time. And so
there was a lot of that happening, but that's all they
talk about, anyways, content, content, content. What was
really cool and funny? Well, really cool and coincidental is
there were two, like tik tokers there. And one of them does,
like luxury travel. And I thought her speaking was really
interesting, because in a world of like ecotourism, you don't
think like luxury, yeah. And I think I like to say that, like,
the kayaking thing is, like, the upscale, it's almost like the
glamping of camping, right? Like, yeah, the clear kayaking
is, like, the Yeah, we Yeah, we're, we're not just like a
rinky dink, you know, side of the road thing. Like, yeah, we
try to create this whole experience out of it. It's
definitely it.
Enhanced version. Yeah. And I think, like, we've all had that
kayak experience, if you've kayaked, or just, I remember my
first time, my first couple times kayaking, you show up and
you rent like a canoe or kayak that looks like maybe there's
three spiders inside of it, and like you don't know where your
butt sitting, so you sit on a life jacket because you don't
want to get your butt dirty, like, so I feel like hours it
was interesting hearing her speak, because she was saying
that luxury travel was kind of up there, and people want to
see, like, if they are not going on a luxury trip, like, they
kind of want to see how it goes. And it was also interesting to
hear how long it takes her to, like, bust out constantly, yeah,
because she likes to live in the moment and experience, yeah, the
thing and not just go to film, which I also loved, yeah, so I
don't know. I thought that was really interesting, too. What
was her name, LAX the luxury or something like that? Yeah, I
think, I think it was, yeah. And then the other guy was more of,
like, the busting out content. JT, yeah. JT, is a great follow,
yeah. I followed him for a while, and it was cool watching
him speak in person about his process. And, yeah, his look,
his outlook at it. And he owns a whole agency that, like,
connects creators to businesses so that your business can kind
of have a face of your business. You know, yeah, form of a
creator. Yep, I again, this is, like a thing that was not. This
wasn't, like, honestly, no, this was we were in the office, and,
yeah, and like, everyone there were, I don't know, like, 100
people in the office that were all listening in the Global Head
of strategy for tick tock, was there, sort of like, so, yes, we
didn't learn content directly. But, like, there were so many
things I didn't know if maybe you heard, like, a tidbit that
was like, Yeah, change, kind of like the way that I think the
book did that more than, more than vive. I think the book did
that, but they did a good job of, like, weaving in some of
that with the Vive content. So I don't know if there was like,
one like moment in vibe where I'm like, oh, I need to do it
that way. But it was more of just like seeing it all happen.
So I I'm not speaking for you, obviously, but like, there's
something that I thought was really great, is during Vive,
each of the Vive members got to have a call with Gary, a little
zoom meeting. And what I thought was really cool is so we have
this community platform on Facebook. We wanted to learn
like after people. We wanted to to have something to where after
people did a tour with us, how they can interact with each
other and like it's not just the end of your experience. No, it's
like, how can we get them excited to, like, talk to each
other, interact with us, like, feel like they can connect with
us, rather than just, like, a business transaction. Yeah, and
I like that. You asked Gary, one of your questions was, like, how
can it be more of, like, a back and forth instead of talking to
the customers? Like, a lot of times it's just us posting and
like, people like it, or maybe, yeah, or maybe they comment on
it. But it's not, it's not them asking questions or posting a
lot. So it's like, how do I do more of that? Yeah. And I
thought what was really cool is that he his piece of advice was
to, like, talk to the guests more. And it's funny because you
already started doing that, and you saw an amazing response. So
you Justin, you have sent out a text message to all the guests
one day. Or was it just Rock Springs guests? No, all of them,
to all the guests. And what did you say? I hope you're having a
good day. Yeah, saying Happy Tuesday. Hope the rest of your
week goes well. This is the founder of get up and go or
something. I don't but do you know how many people, yeah, we
got like 100 plus replies that were like, someone booked a
tour. Thanks so much. Oh, my God. I hope everything's going
well. The coolest thing was someone who had a freaking bad
experience because they didn't show up. Yeah, like,
Yeah. Someone was like, You guys suck or something.
And, and then I replied saying, like, Hey, can you give me some
more info so I can, like, yeah, look it up and get you a better
response and whatever, yeah. And just doing that, like, I went in
and did some research on what happened, and ended up making it
right, and offered maybe a free tour or something for them to
come back. And they were like, and they were like, wow, that's
the coolest thing ever. I know it's, it's that simple, like,
literally just spending a little bit of time, like interacting
with people and hearing them out. And I think people just
want to be heard, you know, and like and and know that we care
about it more than just a transaction. And so yeah, that
that was a good takeaway from that, for sure. What's
interesting is, like, one of the things I've learned from you,
and it's one of your superpowers, which is funny, I
said that one of my superpowers is listening. Yeah, it's
actually one of your superpowers, listening to people
when they're complaining. Yeah, I feel like when I have a
customer calling me and they're so upset, like, I want to have
an answer for everything. And like, Justin has taught me.
You've taught me to literally let them wait until it's quiet
and then you can speak. Because there's so many times you've
been next to me when someone's complaining to me and I'm just
like, well, you want to correct them right away, because all
that they're saying is not true. Everyone's instinct is like, you
want to just correct people, because what they're saying is
not true, not true. Like, you know, I.
For I showed up, and they the kayaks weren't there. And it's
like, no, I want to be like, Well, no, actually, you showed
up. Justin's like, Tia, I'll get off the phone. He's like, next
time, let them he goes, even though, you know it's not true,
let them just talk. Let them go. Like, let them speak. It goes
back, usually, like, air themselves out. And then they
and then they get to the conclusion themselves that,
like, oh, maybe, maybe I am not telling the what that is, like,
a freaking skill that I feel like every business owner should
hear, because I feel like that's the key to like, honestly, it
resolving itself half the time. I feel like people will. They
feel like you're listening and they, you know, like letting
them speak. Yeah, so at the end of them speaking, do you still
correct them? Or what do you say? It's very situational,
like, if they're completely wrong, then usually it's like,
well, you know, I've spoken to my manager, I've spoken to my
team, my tour guides that were there, we all came to the same
conclusion that this is, like, kind of what happened. Am I? Am
I incorrect in saying blank? And then, like, they're like, Well,
yeah, you might be, you know, and then you're and then you get
to the bottom of it, right? But let them go. Yeah, just let them
go. It's, it's funny because, like I said earlier, I said, my
superpower is listening, but when it's like, something like
that, I can't, like, I have to have an answer to everything.
And sometimes it's okay not to have the answer. But the text
messaging thing was, yeah, it's really cool to see people's yeah
response, but I feel like a year ago, you wouldn't have done
something like that, yeah. Well, because, I mean, it caught that
to do that cost me $800
to text everyone and to then give a free tour cost me another
couple 100 bucks and whatever. So like, let's say it cost me
$1,000
I used to think of it as like, you know that that that $1,000
is just a waste, quote, unquote. But now it's like, no, that's
how you build brand. And you may not see the benefits of it that
day, but like, maybe two months later, someone's like, wow.
Remember when the owner of that company texted me and like, if
you can keep on the front of people's minds in a positive
way, like, it's only going to come back to you. Like, I was, I
didn't do it for the hope of, like, an a return on it that
day. I didn't even do it for the hope of a return on it ever. I
was just like, this is a nice thing to do. Yeah, let's show
that we have a little bit of a personality here. And like, open
the door for conversation. And it worked. It was and it was
also, I feel like it was fun for you. Yeah, it was fun. Like, you
don't realize how many people, like, care about the business,
and people told us stories about you guys multiple times, or just
their personal life. And what I loved is that, like, your
message wasn't like, Hey, here's $10 off your next tour. It was
like, like, hoping that was a good weekend, or whatever you
said, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was literally just hope you're doing
good. And people, some people didn't someone, someone was
like, something like their donut, or something didn't get
delivered. We were, we should have, yeah, we're gonna try to,
like, figure out where they live. But it was that would have
taken, like, some people just want to ask, and they'll
remember that. And that's like, an experience, without even,
like, booking a tour with us, which I think is so cool. Yeah,
they might post it on freaking random fun fact, one of our
locations, their like, employee had a flat tire, whatever they
ended up paying for their car to get, like the tire repaired, or,
like, even paid for the Uber or did something for them. The
freaking guide ended up sending it to like, a viral Instagram
page that was called, like, fui quit. Yeah, it's usually
negative about awful bit, like experiences at jobs, like
people, I don't know, fast, yeah, this was, like, one of the
only positive posts they've ever done, and we got a freaking
shout out. So don't go into stuff, doing it for recognition,
but like, you never freaking know, yeah, you do the right
thing and the right things end up happening. Good comes kind of
good. Okay, next question,
got like five different good things out of that. Okay, hard
tangents. Sorry,
this is an exciting one. Was there any connections that you
made during the program that have led you to new
opportunities, or like, collabs coming up, or anything like
exciting, yeah. I mean, share, yeah. James, introducing me to
Thorsten. You know, a guy in Germany who opened 100 plus
subways ended up coming to the US to visit me in our locations
and see what we can maybe work together. So I have a call with
him next week to talk through that more and see what that
looks like. That's huge. I think even the people that are in vive
like talking to Mandy, who's the CMO of Michaels, like she hopped
on a call with me and helped me through the hiring process when
I hired our director of franchise operations, she, she
kind of, yeah, from her perspective, like she's built
these massive teams. She used to work at Kroger, and now she
works at Michael. She's She's worked in these really big roles
and with big teams. And I'm like, how do you build culture,
and how do you know who to hire? It's tough. And so like talking
to her was, was really cool, being able to to get that
understanding.
Ending even the bus ride out to our retreat, like Habib and
Jasmine were two great people to talk to more about, and we ended
up sitting down and, like, I showed them the new CRM that I'm
building. And, like, just that connection, I think could, could
lead to things I don't know what or why or when or how, but like,
who knows
the amount of people that that the Vayner world are connected
to, and then also these other 10 people that we're in vive are
connected to Carrie and her whole Earth Kind business, like
an amazing freaking bugs, yeah, bug spray, like, her bug spray
is out in Titusville now. So, like, these little connections
that just, like, yeah, like, add, add to fun things over
time, you know, as, like, I think if I ever wanted to come
out with, like, a
brand that's focused on giving back to the earth, like, I would
partner with Carrie on that, you know, like, she'd be amazing for
that, they connected me To to Manny, who's done a lot of
huge mascot, logo work, branding work. He even, like, helped Gary
create all of the V friend 2.0
drawings and stuff like that. So connected me with Manny, who's
building our mascot. And could be so exciting. Yeah, yeah. It's
really, really cool helping, like, with some of the branding
stuff, colors and just new things that we're excited for.
And yeah, they connected me to him and like, even if, even if
him and I didn't end up working together, it, they're still
willing to just say, hey, Manny, can you hop on a 30 minute or an
hour call with Justin, just there talk, yeah, but even that,
like, for Manny to pick be like, yeah, sure, why not? Like, pick
up the call, spend 38 minutes to an hour just talking about my
brand, the business, what the vision is. And like, you know,
like, he gave me a lot of feedback, even just on that
call, that I could have then taken and done my own thing, but
we ended up working together. And yeah, Gary was really
excited to hear that. And I guess he when I told Gary that I
was working with Manny, he like, texted Manny and was like, Hey,
I heard you're working with Justin funny. Like, so cool. So
you know what that's really cool, I feel like being in Vive
is, I think it was like Twitter or maybe Instagram. It's like,
when you're verified on Twitter or Instagram, like, the only DMS
you like, you can, like, filter your DMS by like, verified
people. So it's like being in vibe, you're like, verified,
yeah, you're verified,
you're verified, you're like, verified. So it's like, these
people probably have people connect, trying to connect with
them. And it's like they don't want to waste their time talking
to 300 people who might not seriously want to, like, yeah,
be serious about it. So it's like, being in Vive, I feel like
you're like, verified through Andrea and Gary's people. So
it's like, when you want to hop on a call and connect with,
like, these business professionals, it's like, no,
they're verified. Like, they're good. You can, like, they're
like, filtered out. Yeah, I think that's kind of fun. Yeah,
no, it's really that's like, huge perk. And yeah, part of it
too is, like, they told us that going into it, if you want to
talk to anyone in the Who do you want to Yeah, and so that really
gets your wheel spinning. Of like, what could, who could I
talk? I know you're trying to come up with, you know? And so I
had to think of, like, what things would really help my
business? And a mascot is something I've always wanted.
And Gary talked a lot about so that that was really cool to
connect to him. And then Thorsten was one that they came
up with. Because they're like, Hey, we know this guy that's
done franchising on a large level. And the BurgerFi guy, I
was just gonna Yeah, another franchise, yeah, it was almost
franchise, yeah, yeah. In La they were like, here, chat with
him. He'd be amazing. Yeah? They're like, me too. You guys
should talk. Yeah. This guy was a chicken connoisseur. Like,
every fried chicken fried, no chicken fingers, chicken
burgers, chicken, this, chicken that. And like, he's going
through his phone, and it's like, just a spring, or
whatever, not a spring, like Little River in his backyard.
And I'm like, Oh, he's like, legit, like, like I said, it's,
they're almost like filtered out. And it's like they're
connecting you to people who are pretty legit, you know. So I
think that is a huge, huge takeaway for my questions. Okay,
they're good. Okay, I have a couple more there. A lot of
these are, like, amazing questions. So let's get the use
out of them.
Those are kind of the same, how's your how's your vision for
get up and go shifted in any way since doing the program or,
like,
I don't know, a little bit, yeah, I think
they make you kind of think about the future more. I live
in, like, the one to two month world, a lot, like, what's gonna
happen one to two days? Yeah, no, like, what's gonna happen in
the next month, and I don't often get to the five month
ahead world,
but you have to in order to hire people or make changes or figure
out systems that you want to implement. And so
a few of those conversations made me think about that more.
The Daymond John conversation with.
The, you know, obtaining new customers is 25 times more
expensive than just retaining your current ones. That made me
really think about our new CRM system and, like, texting
platform. Text like, yeah, all of that. The Negotiator that we
talked to really made, made me think about, like, the the
future with our book, current booking software, and what that
looks like, you know, is that sustainable over time, as we
continue to grow and give them, you know, 6% of all of those
bookings, like, what does that end up looking like after five
years from now? So it made me think about those things more
for sure. I
do think there was just little things along the way that I was
like, Oh, that's a really smart way to look at that, or to
consider this, even the conversation with Nick
Sonnenberg about the efficiencies and me creating
that whole Help website for get up and go, like, just the little
time, you know, there was like a there's like, a bunch of little
things I felt like that happened along the way that will save me
so much time and effort and money and yeah, and have given
me more of a clear direction on that. And I mean, even on last
or on in August, on the monthly call that I recorded, I was
like, hey, our vision is going to be, you know, I want to get
to 50 locations by the end of next year, which I've never
really put a number out to anyone. It's always just been
like, yeah, we'll see how we grow, you know. And so now,
like, I want to, I think one thing they've talked about is
like, how important it is to share your vision with everyone.
Yeah. And not just like, I live with it in my head, but I never
really out loud, yeah. I never really, well. I never even,
like, think about, like, I know I have direct goals, direct,
like things that I'm trying to achieve over time. And how do
those all correlate to each other? And usually it comes off
in the form of me just saying, Hey, we're changing our systems.
And yeah, and no one like I don't I need to reiterate the
vision of why we're changing. I want 50 locations next year.
It's important that we have systems like changing how we
collect royalties, because it's when you there's 50 people, you
can't be like, hey, it's going through your text. Did that
person send me their Royals? Yeah. And I can't spend 100
hours now, two hours per location, doing that. You know,
it's like, never going to be able to focus on growing the
business so or personal life. You've got it. There
goes our micro. Goes our bike rides. There goes our bike
rides.
There goes our Goldens for the next vive class. Is there any
advice that you'd give them going into it? Yeah,
I think they should
try to they should ask for what they really want, like ask a lot
to James and Andrea and Julia and the whole team, like, don't
be afraid to ask for more conversations, or ask to talk to
more people. Like I kind of felt, even though they told me
to do that, I kind of still like, feel like I'm taking up
people's time. I don't want to do that, so I need to do more of
that. I need to spend more time. So even yesterday, I talked to
the negotiator that we had on months ago. That's cool, yeah.
And like, I'm trying to push myself to do that, like, ask for
that extra time. So I think they should ask for what they really
want to get out of it. But also, like, have a more clear
understanding of what they want to get out of it than I did
going into but they also like going into it, they talked a lot
about people at this, like, transitional moment in their
lives. And I'm not necessarily in a transitional moment in my
life. I'm still know that I want to grow, get up and go, like I'm
not trying to separate myself from it, like I'm still working
that. And so for for people that are going through transitions, I
think it's even more useful because they have some really
good resources and feedback and and understanding of what big
transition looks like.
So I think just knowing yourself a lot going into it and asking
yourself maybe some of those questions, like, am I going
through a transition? Who do I want to talk to? What do I want
to get out of this? And in knowing that better, you
probably would get more out of it if you knew those answers to
those questions going into it sweet, yeah, yeah. I think I
also think that what I really liked is that before Vive, like,
officially started, you obviously had a clear direction
of, like, how long it was gonna take, like, the amount of time,
yeah, and I think, like, a big one is you always made yourself
very present, like, even when we scheduled, like, trips, yeah,
yeah. Don't miss no. Don't miss out. I feel like to really get
the full impact of Vive, like, like you did. You just every
Friday you knew that there was meetings, like, we'd be driving,
and you'd had the zoom on, and we were, like, actively
listening. It's like, from a kayak one, yeah, you did it from
a Yes, you did. You even, like, showed them under the spring
water. I think so. I think being super present and just like,
knowing being committed to it, like, show up, don't just sign
up for it. And I don't think anyone did that. But like, don't
just sign up for it. Like, be really fully in and committed.
And, like.
Anytime you know there's a zoom or, like, an activity, like,
you're going to be around these really respected people in the
industry and do it, yeah, yeah. Don't, don't miss out on these
things. Like, ronsley lives in Australia and was on these calls
at like, 4am one time in Australia. I think he, like, had
a layover in Dubai, and still showed up, yeah, but that's, I
mean, you're paying for it like you should want to, and you
should be, you know, yeah. So I feel like, I love that you are
so present. And I feel like,
Yes, you got the value very soon after doing Vive, but I think
you saw it through all the way, and like you were always, yeah,
taking initiative to make sure that, like, hey, my schedule is
cleared for this. This is important. I'm committed to
this. There was a lot of emphasis during the VI program
of wellness.
Was there any strategies that you learned during the program
that helped you manage stress or help avoid burnout, or anything
you can share that like, really stood out to help with your
wellness? Yeah, I think as a whole, I never really have
thought about wellness too much, not nearly as much as I should.
Especially being like an entrepreneur that works from
home doesn't really get out much. And, you know, maybe,
yeah, maybe I go and, like, go to locations once in a while, or
go hang out with friends once in a while, go to dinner or
whatever. But like, work wise, like, I'm here every day in my
office working. You don't, you don't think about the wellness
side of it too much. You just deal with it. And you're like,
oh well, you know, whatever. I'm a little tired today, or I'm a
little burnt out, but I'm still doing it.
So it made me think about that more. You know, we had a sleep
expert on and we have our aura rings now,
which have been really, yeah, we love that. And just tracking
sleep. You know, I did a sleep study knowing that I have mild
sleep apnea. And now next step is like, Okay, how do we device?
How do we, yeah, treat that and work on that just being
healthier, like even the first day or the second day when we
were there and Mona and
Mona and Chef palak were cooking for us, like the healthy foods,
and just like giving us a better understanding of that body, even
at V con, we, you know, there's a wellness a whole wellness
presentation. We're so so many good things sleep. Sleep is so
important. You Like, literally, I think that's like, everyone's
feedback has been that, like, sleep is like, one of the most
important things, and something that I never recovered, paid
much attention to until recently, where I've felt like,
Man, I'm getting a good amount of sleep, but I don't really
feel like I'm getting a good amount of sleep, you know, yeah,
and it's because of the sleep apnea thing,
so I think like that, and just acknowledging that, you know,
like I do need to ask for help if I feel overwhelmed, or just
Understanding the mental state that I'm in when I'm doing work,
or also, like, understanding that because I'm in a room doing
work every day, like my tour guides don't get to see, that my
franchisees don't really get to see, that they don't know that
I'm, like, working a lot every Day, doing these things for them
and caring about them behind the scenes. So it's like, even maybe
communicating that more to people, and not saying, Hey, I'm
working my ass off every day, but like, just reinforcing like,
Hey, thank you what you're doing, yeah, I see the work that
you're putting in. Like, thank you, you know, and and
acknowledging that piece of it a little bit more. So, yeah, I
feel like there's been a lot of wellness things that have, that
have come from it. And you and I were going to the gym a lot,
which we need to get back on that grind of doing. But I've
been traveling a lot, riding our bikes, getting outside. I love
my Pilates. But yeah, you've been doing really good with
that, just, yeah, spending more time outside. And, like, even we
were talking about, like, different lighting at night
time, like, we got the hatch next door, shout out hat, shout
out our ring. Yeah. Like, we've, we've actually done, I know some
of the things like, and we got the cold pillows too. I have. So
listen, if there's one thing that you should implement in
your home, and we got my parents on it. Fun fact, we live with my
parents for like, three months after our wedding, while our
house was being built. And we turned them on to this, keep
your house cold at keep your house cold at night. Like, if
you lower your temp to what was that? What was like? The ideal
was like between 6061 and 68 I know it costs money, but, like,
it doesn't cost much if you look at it. What's the value of
better sleep? Yeah. I mean, I mean, we keep ours at 6069 at
night. Yeah, yeah, it's good. It is so nice to sleep in the cold
anyways, yes, cold pillows, cold pillows, or ring hatch recipe
four, we were talking about, you.
We stayed with your parents, and then you went to cold
temperature. I was saying when we say, I was like, if there's
something you can do, like, lower your temperature. We
stayed with my parents. We transitioned them, and they
never been the same. Yeah, I thought you were also gonna say
cold pillow, because we got your mom on. I did get my mama. My
mom has hot flashes, shout out, menopause, and I and I got my
mom a pillow that's cooling. So I just, yeah, they say that the
cooler your body is, the better you sleep. So cold, temperature,
cold pillow every morning we literally, that's disgusting. It
can I see that they can literally get down rainy every
morning we get up and we're so excited to check, like, our
sleep score. It's nice, because you might be like, Oh, I had
shitty sleep last night. But when you actually can, like,
pull it up and it tracks your sleep, that's so cool. Yeah,
yeah, I love that. Not only are you learning about wellness,
you're actually doing things to implement how to be better with
wellness in our everyday life. So we've been eating so much
better. Step is a bed that cools. I don't know about that.
He was like, looking No, I mean, she was raving about, I I just
don't know if I like the look of it. Yeah, I'm into the esthetic.
It's literally like a big blow dryer machine under your bed.
Absolutely not. We can figure out a way around it. Hey, if
it's better sleep, it's better sleep. I think we can. I think
we were just, you were just praising the better. I think we
can get there without the blow dryer under the bed. Okay, okay.
I think the only other questions I have here, I mean, from a
partner perspective,
from your person, if you have a partner entering Vive, call me
at one 800
No. I think, I think what's really important is having,
like, a good support system.
Just be a listening year after people do Vive,
no, I feel like it was really nice to have a supportive,
probably for you to have such a supportive,
yeah, it was, yeah, I agree. I mean, it was fun having you come
to the couple events that you came to see, seeing everything
happen in lifetime, getting to understand, I learned something
you know more about who everyone is, and meeting Gary and seeing
who he is in person, and
and, and yeah, and then just weekly, like, debriefing about
the phone calls and who we, who I talked to on the Zoom call.
You know that that weekend, and the little takeaways from that,
and in the implement, implementing these different
things. And me just being like, hey, we need to try this. Like
someone just said it on a call, let's do it. And you're, you're
like, Yeah, let's try it and see, you know, like, let's see
it. Let's Yep, let's do it. And, yeah, that part of it's been
really cool. And also, like, again, it's a, it's a hefty
price tag. So, you know, be being on board with that piece
of it, and you're, you're kind of like saying you believe in
me, because you want me to go and do this thing that I'm
thinking is going to be worth it. So that that piece of it is
cool too,
to have your support in doing it was definitely cool. You know,
like,
at first it's like, you're spending how much to do what,
and then it's like, okay, if you, if you think it's going to
be worth it. And you know, you've had those conversations
you trust me and in that, like you're saying, Go, Go do it, and
see what it's like and see, see how it is. So definitely
important to have someone that understands it, supports it and
is behind you in it, and will do do whatever is, you know, like I
had to go and do things and you were here taking care of
whatever needs to be taken care of. So having someone that will
support you through it, so you can show up every every Friday
on the Zoom calls, or you can go to New Mexico for a week, or you
can go to do whatever it is that you know that that's part of it
is definitely a big thing from it. So, yeah, they say Happy
wife, happy life. But I think it's like, happy husband, happy
life, is it? I think so. I think it's just, if you're happy,
you're happy, you're both happy. Yeah, you know, it's like, I was
just telling someone that when you're happy with who you're
surrounding yourself with, or like, in life, everything else
is like a domino effect, like happy life, happy business,
happy it's happy everything. It's it isn't just happy
significant other, happy life. It's happy every Yeah, and that
was, it's funny, because that was kind of Gary's like ending
talk at his becon is that was his. Why are people doing things
don't make you hold on, let's we're talking about that. What
do you want to talk about? I thought one of the most moving
pieces of V con was during Gary's keynote. Yeah? The ending
one or the opening one. It's ending keynote, right? Yeah,
yeah, yeah. His ending keynote. He had said that he actually
mentioned it at dinner the night before that he was going to talk
about it, but in line or whatever during these like Meet
and Greet photo things or whatever, he noticed throughout
the weekend that there were people who, I think he had met
them at an earlier event or something where they weren't
happy with their job. And he was like, then he met them at.
Previous V con, where they told him directly, hey, I'm not happy
with what I'm doing. How do I change this? And he said, that's
what you do. Yeah. Why is it that so many people
are live in an unhappy place? Yes, but what's crazy, and he
brought it into perspective, is like, if people work a nine to
five, five days a week, that is so much of your we spend so much
of our life working, why would we not change that? It's funny.
Like, when people aren't happy in a marriage, they leave a
marriage, they spend more time at work than at the house with
their miserable husband or wife. So why are people getting
divorces but not leaving bad jobs? Yeah, they need to divorce
their jobs. Yes. Divorce your job. 2025 Yeah. No. I do think
it's an important takeaway is,
like, that whole ending thing is just, if one people, if one
person could take something away from it is like, don't spend
time doing the things that you don't like doing. And a lot of
that is your work life, you know, if you're miserable, but
you're making $150,000
in a year. Could you be happy? Yes, at a hat, at a nice job,
making $50,000 a year. Yes, like, why would you who cares
about the 150 like, at the end of the day, if you're not happy,
but you're making money? Who cares? Like you're not happy,
you're not gonna have a fun life if you're not happy every day,
you know. So
I think vive really pushed that too. Is is they? They made us
think about like, Are you, are you happy in what you're doing
currently? And that's why they talk a lot about transition, is
because a lot of these people aren't happy with what they're
doing, and they need some sort of transition. It's a little bit
harder as you become C suite or entrepreneur, owner of an entire
business, and people rely on you. It becomes harder and
harder, but that's why it's so important to do it now and not
keep waiting until, until you are in that hard position. But
you know, it's like, why would you want to see it with friends?
It's like, I tell people all the time, like, like, dude or
dudette, you seem unhappy, like, in your in your work, like, did
you just say Dudette, you know? Like, come on. Like, why are you
doing this? Like, I know, like, that's one thing that you
actually taught me. Like, very early on in our relationship,
there were so many and it's funny because I remember when I
was like, younger, and let's say, like, I needed to call it
work, because I didn't feel good. Like, even I think I was
like, 20 years old, like, I'm texting my mom, like, I don't
feel good mom, like, I don't want to go to work. I She
doesn't even live near me. And she's like, Oh, you need to call
out. And I'm like, I'm scared. You're afraid. I'm afraid to
call it. She's like, you're good. Like, it's almost like I'm
looking for that reassurance, and it's and I remember you're
just like, What are you like? What? What's the big deal? Like,
yeah, why? If they care about you. You have to feel good to go
to work. Like, call out, like, if you don't feel good, yeah, if
you, if so, what's the difference if you don't feel
good, you're calling out of work. If you don't feel good,
why are you going to work? Yeah, I remember there being times
where I didn't want to do something, and you're just like,
don't do it. Like, then why are you doing it? It's not the end
of the world. Like, and, yeah, it's like, every time we talk,
it's like, not me and you, but like me and a different friend.
It's like, they're complaining about the same thing six months
later. And I'm like, What did you change? Yeah, like, what?
It's not gonna change unless you change. It is so important. And
I think at our age and even younger, it's, it's even more
important, like, for the younger ages, if you don't like it, do
and you just, I feel like that was, like, a big thing that you
taught me too. It's like, my parents obviously taught me
that. But like, you guys all were just like, if you don't
like something, then do not do it. Make sure. And Gary said it
too. Like, don't just quit jobs if you have, like, plenty of
bills to pay. But like, what are you applying for other jobs?
Like, what are you doing in life? Getting you out of that
situation? You cannot bitch about it if you're not doing
anything at all to Yeah, you don't get to complain if you're
not trying to change. How wild is it that the people who
complain aren't doing things to change? That's usually, what's
why is that comfort people are afraid of change? Yeah, I think
people are afraid of the unknown, of like, going out of
their comfort zone to find something different. It's
that's, I think that's the big question mark. Is like, why are
people so afraid of that when all it's going to do is make
them happier? I know, but that's what so much isn't that it like,
does that they're like, afraid they're going to let down a boss
that's doesn't even care about. I know, and that's what you
would always say to me, yeah. Like, with a friend when you
have to cancel plans, it's like, if you're worried about making
them mad, like, are they going to be in your life three years
from now? Like, what? And you always say, like, in the grand
scheme of life's life, how important is that? Yeah. And if
you actually think about it, it's not so, why are we so okay
with just not being happy? Yeah, yeah. So that's maybe one of the
big, biggest takeaways, is, like, don't waste time doing
things you don't like doing. But I also think that, like, Gary's
a good going into this, I wasn't, like, a huge Gary V
like, I just didn't know too much about him, yeah, but like,
even going to V con, like, it's a limited amount of people that
can go, because you have to have, like, the ticket from the
ticket from the NFT.
Right? And it's like, when you would see some of these really
famous speakers, you could get close to them, because there
wasn't, it wasn't like a full house where you guys are, like,
fighting to get good seats, because it's so personal. And
when you look at how big of a production, like the stage was,
the lighting was, like, the outside venue they had, the
freaking Grammys museum was shut down for the weekend for the
conference. Like, if you think about it from like, a business
perspective, how much money it probably cost to put on V con,
and then, like, how many attendees there were to, like,
the scale of this big thing. Like, he is not just speaking,
but he's like, proof that. Like, he's not in it. Like,
yeah, and if he can change a couple people's perspective on
their work life, then he's won, I know. And like, it's crazy
when he's doing this speech on the stage, like everyone could
be so close to him when he's saying it, because he purposely
put on this huge production where you still feel like you're
right there with him. Yeah. And what's really cool is during him
speaking and saying, like, you know how he's talked to people
this year who were previously unhappy and, like, they've quit
the jobs and they've changed things in their lives. He
actually had people stand up, yeah, there was, there was like,
15 I had goosebumps all over my body. He said, I like challenge
you to, like, do things that'll change you being in that
situation. Yeah, and I'm so curious at the next V con, like,
that'll come up. But even the night before, we were at dinner
and he showed up, which was not expected, and he, like, was
really touched at how many times he kind of, like, saw that
recurring thing that during that weekend. So, yeah, I just, I
forgot all about that. But like, there it isn't, like, how much
money am I gonna make from doing this? It's like, No, how much
happiness? Yeah. Like, happiness is so much more important than
any amount of money. And say it. But like, people don't live it,
yeah, yeah. And I think he embodies, like, living it too,
which is very rare for someone of that, like, well, he gets to
work early and leaves late because he literally just loves
what he does, or drives 30 minutes, streaming at like
11:30pm while he's working. And I'm like, he just loves it, you
know, like I do too. That's why I'm in bed at midnight, sitting
on my laptop, doing work, because I love working. More. Do
you love enjoying, like, life more? Do you or do you think
they're equal? There's they're not equal. But I find enjoyment
out of both. Like, I find enjoyment out of progressing the
work and, like, opening new locations, giving people more
opportunities, yeah, higher, you know, getting more tour guides
because of that, giving back more money because of that. But
like, when we go on a vacation or hang out with the dogs, or
go, you know, bring the dogs kayaking, or whatever, like that
stuff is so much fun. And so, like, I enjoy both of that, both
of that, but, like, at midnight, I can't necessarily go kayaking
with my dogs, but I can do some work stuff that I find is
somewhat enjoyable, you know, and it to be real. It freaking
it funds the life. It funds it like you enjoy it. How lucky are
you that you are doing something every day that, like, also
funds, like, this incredible life that we can Yeah? Well,
that's the sweet spot. If you find something that you can make
money and you're happy now you've won, and you've always
had that since day one. Yeah, so like, and I'm always just like,
it's only kayaking at the end of the day. If you're that stressed
out about it, like, you know, you also got to look at the
other side. Like, the happiness part is cool, but when it is
tough, you also have to understand that, like, it's
we're not like rocket scientists or doctors, like we're just
providing a fun experience for people. And what's also just to
point out, there's been times like where, like, if I get
stressed out with kayaking stuff, because business can be
stressful at some points. Like, even in our industry, we work on
like, I'm a franchisee of yours. You say you do say that you're
like, if you don't enjoy it, then don't do it like. You don't
just say it to like other things. You say it like, as soon
as it doesn't become we say it to our tour guides, as soon as
you stop enjoying being a tour guide, yeah, I will support you
doing anything as long as you're happy. So I think practicing
what you preach is so important. I feel like you do that, like on
the reg, yeah, if I ever stop enjoying this, I would find
something else, you know, but I haven't stopped enjoying it, and
it's been eight years. So like, even going into kayaking, I
thought I was gonna be a tour guide the rest of my life. I
never thought I was gonna go do this. Like, I literally was
like, you are, you are the bread and butter of the business,
yeah, like, and I still, right now, would be happy if I was
doing tours and not making what I'm making now and still just
being happy doing what I'm doing. You know, I think you
need to have me on here more often. Yeah, we have some. I
mean, how many? How long has it been since we started filming? I
know it's been a while, it's been a minute, so I feel like we
could talk for hours, but we won't talk people. I feel like
you need your own podcast at this point. I think you would
like your own podcast. I think so too. I have a lot to say.
Apparently, I told you that was one of my skills, I know, but I
think you would like your own Yeah, yeah. I think it's so much
fun I could talk for hours, yeah. Well, you should.
Just like, set this room up to where, okay, don't get carried
away. We
already have one room in that. You have your own podcast room.
That would be awesome. Well, for the next home that we build,
yeah, we'll have a farm in Idaho or Wyoming that has a podcast
room. We can fly, perfect. Yeah, I can have the cows on so what
you're saying is we need to do more podcasts together. I like
it. I think,
yeah, we don't get to debrief like this. We do at dinner
randomly when we're in bed talking or hanging out talking.
But yeah,
not directly for, you know, an hour and a half of like, just
going deep into it. So it's fun, it's fun, and you're good at
talking and listening. What a skill your superpower. Yes. All
right, signing off T and J, yeah. Is that what we call
ourselves? J and T, T and J The bootsies. The bootsies.
Peace. There you have it, guys, the end of the debrief of the
vibe by Vayner program with Tia. Had a really fun time recording
this with her. I think you guys can probably see that through
the camera. It was fun. Our dogs kind of hopped in and out in the
background from time to time, and gave us a little bit of
distraction. But this was really fun being able to go backwards
and reflect on the experience and moving forward. I'm still
part of what they're calling the Elevate program. Now it's kind
of the ongoing monthly thing for another year that we're going to
be a part of. So really looking forward to that. They've
actually invited Tia to be a part of that as well. So we're
kind of going into it as like a package deal, and being able to
continue the these learnings that we've been having from Vive
and the community that they've built already and really
excited. So thank you guys for sticking around for all three
parts. Hope you enjoyed it and hope it was a little valuable
for you guys to be a fly on the wall while we kind of debriefed
about my experience with vive. Thanks again. See ya.