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Josh Dech - CHN (00:00.209)
Doug, just to get ahead of it, I forgot one time and never since.

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Doug Kaufmann (00:03.15)
Yes, okay, good, excellent. Good to see you. Are people finding, I know people are finding you, they're telling me they're finding you. Very good, that's good.

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Josh Dech - CHN (00:05.649)
Very good. So good to see you again. First of all, thanks for doing this.

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Josh Dech - CHN (00:12.497)
Yeah, no, it's been amazing. I really appreciate that. It's been look, Kate's actually down in Dallas right now. She's not too far from your neck of the woods. Yeah, yeah, she's over at the Gaylord Resort there.

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Doug Kaufmann (00:18.094)
wow, that's... yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and you stayed in Canada.

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Josh Dech - CHN (00:24.336)
So.

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Yes. So anyway, she's down there for now, but she is. She's enjoying it.

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Doug Kaufmann (00:27.854)
Wow.

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She's hot. She's hot. It's like 102 degrees. So, yeah.

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Josh Dech - CHN (00:36.655)
Yeah, she made sure I knew about it. She called me yesterday on video. She's at the poolside. I'm like, that sucks. It's raining here. But she's loving it. So Doug, what do we want to go through today for specifics? Now it's all gut. So anything gut related, you want to do fungus, you want to do whatever. What is tickling your fancy? What's on your heart today?

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Doug Kaufmann (00:42.446)
Exactly. man.

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Doug Kaufmann (00:51.566)
Mm -hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (01:00.238)
Let's see your, okay that's up, that's down. how cool is that? Okay, test, test. I wanna talk about whatever is on your heart. By the by, I just ran a tape last night of Dr. Ghanoum. He is the head, Dr. Ghanoum is the mycologist who,

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Josh Dech - CHN (01:04.526)
yeah, test test.

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Doug Kaufmann (01:19.342)
approves antifungal drugs at Case Western University, a friend of mine. And this was a four -year -old tape where I interviewed him. Yeah, I know. And during this interview, I asked him, he had just published another paper, he's published a lot of them, on the gut terrain.

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Josh Dech - CHN (01:27.63)
Everyone's a friend of yours.

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Doug Kaufmann (01:39.406)
And he said, you know what, Doug, the most interesting thing is everybody believes Crohn's disease is a bacterial infection. So everybody gives antibiotics. And everybody doesn't get better.

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And I'm the guy who discovered the milieu, the fungus, the candida overgrowth, the other fungi in the gut. And we now know that if you treat Crohn's with antifungals and perhaps some antibiotics, they get better quicker. And then he confirmed, nicest thing he said, and this was four years ago, in honor of you, Doug, they are now finding a fungus linked to cancer. And I said, I know it's not in honor of me. They fought me for 40 years on that. But I think that

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Josh Dech - CHN (02:15.95)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (02:21.824)
The tides are finally changing and doctors are realizing that cancer does not spontaneously initiate, same with gut problems, that something starts it and that's where fungus plays a role. It's kind of very exciting for me.

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Josh Dech - CHN (02:37.562)
Well, well, I mean, you basically spent your life doing fungus, so we can definitely get into that. We haven't gone into fungus yet entirely on the show. I talk about it a fair bit in the way of how it relates to gut disease and SIBO conditions. We've not dove into fungus really in its entirety, so that'd be an excellent place to go. Amazing. All right, well, I will do a quick kickoff with a quick welcome to, of course, we'll do a standard introduction and I always do my intros post edit, so I'll get all the fancy stuff after the fact.

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Doug Kaufmann (02:40.781)
Mm -hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (02:52.528)
Let's do it. Let's do it. I love that. I love it. Okay.

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Doug Kaufmann (03:04.781)
Good, OK, good. Good.

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Josh Dech - CHN (03:06.318)
Brilliant. In that case, Doug Kaufman, welcome to reversible.

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Doug Kaufmann (03:11.789)
Good to be with you, Josh. You were here in my studio, what, a few months ago. And it's finally good to see you across the continent, as they say.

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Josh Dech - CHN (03:15.566)
I was.

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Josh Dech - CHN (03:19.758)
Yeah, you know, it's really interesting to be back in the same sphere again, the way we got connected was just awesome. It's always through someone who's getting better from a condition or disease that they should never recover from yet. Here they are. And we share a lot of the same mind in that way. Now, something I'm very interested to get into with you today is your specialty. I mean, you've spent your life studying fungus. But before we do get into that and its connection to gut and gut health and other diseases, Doug, who the hell are you?

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Hehehehehe

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Doug Kaufmann (03:51.789)
You know Ruth asked me that often we've been married what 46 years Who do you think you are and who are you?

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Josh Dech - CHN (03:56.121)
Who do you think you are?

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Doug Kaufmann (04:01.453)
Look, I'm a guy that was in college at 17, 18 years old. I got a draft notice. Nobody, that was a time, Josh, far before you, where you could watch the war on television. I mean, they had ABC, NBC, helicopters landing, body bags being shipped. And I did not want to go to Vietnam. And so I went down, took my physical, and the,

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The doctor said, you know, I couldn't fill the cup at the end. I couldn't urinate. So he had me drinking water. Nice guy. I realize now, Josh, he was likely a guardian angel. And he said, no, take your time. And we got to talking. And I said, look, I'm just scared to death of going to Vietnam. And he said, are you going? And I said, yeah, if I go. I got drafted if I go into the Army. I'm off to Vietnam. And he said, well.

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why don't you go to the Air Force, go to the Coast Guard and, you know, see if you can get in there?" And I said, do I have that option? He said, yeah. So I went to the Navy, ended up becoming, little did I know, what they call a hospital corpsman. We are trained in emergency medicine and well -trained in emergency medicine. We are then a couple years after that training, we go through various schools. After that training, you get a pack on your back and a little .45 gun in your holster and off you go. Hospital corpsman.

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are the Marines liaison to emergency care out in the field. What a year, Josh. We could do an hour on that alone. Came home sick. I had contracted malaria and I felt I was a totally different Doug Kaufman. I had jungle rock growing on my arms and legs, which is why I wear long sleeve shirts now, and all sorts of health problems. I was paranoid. I worked with Dr. Everett Hughes at USC Medical School on a collaborative

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Josh Dech - CHN (05:28.388)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (05:50.191)
of a couple of papers, and he was on the ninth floor. If I got on that elevator, Josh, with anybody else, my heart would just pound. I was so nervous. I was a different guy than I left.

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So I figured out, Dr. Hughes said to me, did you eat raw fish in Vietnam? And I said, yeah, I did. It was called nuoc mam. And he said, I think you have a parasite. Go get a book at the library and study parasitology. Well, I realized that yeast and fungi parasitize man.

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And that's one of their jobs, one of several of their jobs. And once on board, they can wreak havoc on the gut or any tissue in the body. And that has become a 54 -year study for me. I started a show on the radio. I introduced doctors to the both localized and systemic fungal conditions. And a lot of people who had gotten well came to me and put me on radio for free.

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and then on television for free and the rest was history. Some of them found the content was good. And I'm now 25 years into a career on television that we film right here, as you know, we film right here at our studio. We try and find people like you, Josh, people who see miracles on a regular basis. And we interview them more and more doctors. That was rare 25 years ago, but more and more doctors ever since COVID, I think, are coming out and saying, gosh, I wondered about

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all that and we love having them on the show. Controversialized it is, the core is still fungus. My main goal is to teach people that yeah bacteria can hurt you, yeah viruses can hurt you and protozoa, but fungus is a much bigger deal I believe than the three of those.

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Josh Dech - CHN (07:41.699)
This is really interesting topic to dive into because so many of us know about bacteria or parasites. We don't know enough about fungus unless you're watching The Last of Us or something else. And so the fungus, it's interesting because...

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Doug Kaufmann (07:51.181)
Yeah.

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Josh Dech - CHN (07:54.942)
Off air, we were talking about people being given antibiotics for things like irritable bowel syndrome, Crohn's disease, and they develop worse in conditions because these fungi, they're very opportunistic in nature. They take the chance and there's nothing to police them, no good bacteria to overgrow, which is the nature of fungus. And there's some really bizarre fungi out there that will literally mind control ants and different animals and creatures. So in its essence, what is fungus and how is it different than

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regular bacteria, be it good or bad bacteria.

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Doug Kaufmann (08:26.413)
So let's drop back a little. The discovery of bacteria came along with Lewinhoek, the glass grinder. No education, but he ground glasses for a living. And then they had those monocular, you know, back in the English days. Hello. And that was Lewinhoek, a guy named Lewinhoek. And one day he laid a monocular, he was grinding it, you know, sand and clearing it up and you could see through it. And he laid it down in some water and he discovered what we call little beasts.

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Josh Dech - CHN (08:40.765)
Hehehehe

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Doug Kaufmann (08:54.541)
And this was several hundred years ago. His original development was a monocular microscope that tiny things became bigger under. It was during that time, 18th century, that we began to realize these little buggers are bacteria and they must have everything to do with everything. Fungi were the first diagnosable medical conditions, albeit of...

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of worms they found and they could transmit that fungus back and forth from a well worm to a sick worm. And this was south of France where silk worms were a huge business. Mike Rinaldi who's a PhD mycologist, that's a guy who studies fungus, wrote an excellent book on this. But fungi have been here all along. Go back to Leviticus where the Lord tells Moses and his brother Aaron, see this land Canaan, I'm giving it to you as your possession but remember what it said.

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there in Leviticus. If I put a spreading mildew in a home in that land, you have to go call the high priest and he's got to get you out of there and have got on your clothes, have got on your skin, leprosy, right? So fungus has always been, it's mentioned in the Old Testament 30 times derogatorily. Don't be like the yeast of the Pharisees. And yet I was looking at medical books, they don't touch on it. Everything's bacteria and virus. And yet the Bible touches on it huge and not bacteria and virus. The words aren't mentioned in the Bible. So I went with the earlier, I went

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with that old, old book, thousands of year old book, and I began to build a career around that. Fungi, unlike bacteria, need to eat. Fungi must have carbohydrates once they're in your body in order to survive. And so the typical patient suffering from a fungal condition craves carbs. They crave sugars.

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You know, look in that center console in your car, look in your sock drawer. If you've got sugar hiding around the house, you may have a fungal condition. It must have carbs, pasta, breads, cakes, soda pops, et cetera. Must have alcohol in order to thrive. So carbs.

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Doug Kaufmann (11:02.317)
And in killing a fungus perfectly is impossible because yeast cells, yeast are single cell fungi. Yeast cells and human cells are almost identical. So to kill yeast or fungus perfectly is to kill human cells perfectly. Enter antibiotics. Antibiotics, as you point out, and you did such a good job on the show here.

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Josh Dech - CHN (11:19.896)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (11:26.797)
You point out that they're indiscriminate bacteria killers. They don't care if it's good bacteria or bad bacteria. They're going to kill it. So this leaves us with so many questions about antibiotics. We now know they are overused. Not a little bit. They are grossly overused according to our here in the US Center for Disease Control. About 50 to 70 million prescriptions of antibiotics annually are unnecessary.

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Now doctors are in their medical education, they learn, hey, no big deal, you know, antibiotics don't hurt you. In fact, they're linked, increased risk of cancer and other diseases as you expound upon gut diseases are intimately linked to the taking of antibiotics. It's almost as though our doctors learn in their medical training that antibiotics are good guys. And I was in the field of medicine. I took antibiotics, I probably abused them, I was paranoid about every germ in the world.

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And then I get out in the real world and realize these little buggers might be due, our sicknesses might be due to antibiotic intake. They are intimately linked with obesity.

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Why didn't we know? We give them to cows. We don't give them to cows to improve their IQ or make them more handsome. We give them to cows so they grow fast, right? They're growth promoters. Then we give them to kids and we wonder why the child's obese at three years old. We're not thinking straight in medicine. These are pills that should be reserved. We have a saying here, FUPO, fungus.

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Josh Dech - CHN (12:50.164)
Mm -hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (13:03.98)
until proven otherwise. I think fungus should be ruled out first as an infection. That's easy. Diet and caprylic acid, you know, coconut fatty acids, etc. Rule that out first and then go with the big guns, your antibiotics, because they can be life -saving, but we're now seeing a very dark side to them.

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Josh Dech - CHN (13:10.64)
Hehehehe

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Josh Dech - CHN (13:23.538)
Hmm. It's a really...

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Fascinating topic to explore and sometimes downright depressing we start looking at certain medications being thrust upon us in the medical industry I was working with a nine -year -old girl about a year or so ago Who from the age of two and three every time she gets sick she get the flu have a bellyache she go to the doctor parents who take her in and they give her antibiotics just because just to see what happens and by here she is at age seven years old she developed colitis before she came to see me age nine and so now she's got bleeding bowels and you know

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Doug Kaufmann (13:29.292)
you

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Doug Kaufmann (13:46.764)
Yep. Yep.

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Doug Kaufmann (13:52.812)
Yep. Yep.

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Josh Dech - CHN (13:55.796)
look at bacteria in the body, so many of us are sort of conditioned to go bacteria is bad, sanitized, clean, etc. But the best, the healthiest people are going to be farmers who are exposed to animals and the dirt and nature on an on stop basis. If we compare the data looking at the gut microbiomes of rural Nigerians versus urbanized or say

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Urban rural, I get the mixed up. Yeah, rural is distant. So rural Nigerians versus more urbanized American cities, they have much more diversity, not nearly half the health problems we see. If we go back to being in utero, we can actually see this translocation or movement of microbes from mom's blood and these metabolic byproducts into the baby. Like they're an integral part of us. Yeah, we kill them off so much. And then this fungus overgrows. And so when fungus overgrows,

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Doug Kaufmann (14:20.912)
Hahaha

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Josh Dech - CHN (14:47.058)
What is it doing to us in our system and why is it so problematic?

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Doug Kaufmann (14:52.03)
The question is a good one and it begs this question. What is fungus doing down there? God put it there. Candida albicans, we must activate it to make it ugly, right? Candida albicans is a commensal organism. It's there with bacteria.

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and in our gut. And it thrives on our nutrition, good nutrition, good bacteria, symbiosis, right? Good bacteria, good yeast, et cetera. Antibiotics are one of the things, chemicals that are in our diet can change the milieu. Dr. Ghanoum at Case Western University, who's a mycologist, calls this the mycobiome, not the micro, tiny, but the mycobiome.

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MyCO denotes fungus. And so what changes the terrain of the intestine? I've got to tell you, I'm staring down the pipe at my age, 54 years into this study, realizing, my gosh, antibiotics start all this. The damage done by antibiotics doesn't get fixed.

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the killing of the good bacteria, how do we make some B vitamins, vitamin K? This good bacteria in our intestine is erased. And then we begin craving the wrong foods. That's how ugly these fungi are. To kill fungus, first of all to diagnose fungus. This is where we're sorely inadequate in America. We guess, okay, running a fever, a little fibril.

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Looks like your lymph nodes are a little swollen. You're going on an antibiotic. Anything, Josh, with ITIS denotes inflammation, swelling to you and me. And boy, ITIS gets an antibiotic immediately. If they only knew who's going to kill the goose, lay in the golden egg, and tell the pharmaceutical industry your antibiotics are quite harmful, especially when taken for long periods of time. Enter Lyme disease.

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Josh Dech - CHN (16:54.45)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (17:04.365)
What do you do for Lyme? Enter MRSA. You know, these are antibiotic driven. This is an antibiotic driven problem. We have a compulsion, an addiction to prescribe antibiotics. One antibiotic can begin altering the terrain of the intestine. We don't take one antibiotic. As I spoke about earlier a couple years ago, there were 200 million prescriptions just in America, just in one year, 30 % of which

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aren't necessary. Houston, we have a problem. We are making ourselves sick with this overuse of antibiotics. And if I can just shout out to all my friends who are physicians and dentists, look, behind every successful pediatrician is a lawyer. You what? You didn't, her eardrum is now burst because you didn't put her on the antibiotic? Well,

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Her fever was low, I didn't think this was bacterial, she lives in a moldy home. You know the rule. Behind every successful antibiotic prescriber is the common sense, maybe not all my patients need an antibiotic and the one that happens where it would have benefited the child to be on an antibiotic is where the lawyer comes in. If you and I were doctors, Josh and we both have similar medical training, if we were doctors, well, I can't speak for you.

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I'd probably be prescribing antibiotics. I got 5 ,000 lawyers ready to defend me in the pharmaceutical industry. It's mandated. You graduate from medical school learning to do this. If you're not prescribing hundreds of medicines a week, something's wrong with you, and you're gonna be questioned, and your license is going to be questioned. Why did you become a doctor and you're not prescribing? What are you, a quack?

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Josh Dech - CHN (18:36.082)
Soon. You're almost required to do it.

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Josh Dech - CHN (18:46.162)
Scratch on the pen pad.

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Doug Kaufmann (18:58.54)
putting people on diet and supplements, they're not FDA approved. So, you know, I understand these last few years have opened my eyes to what doctors must go through to maintain the Porsche and the two homes and, you know, the beautiful clothing and the private schools and so forth. It's easy for me to chip away at them and say shame on them. But the last four or five years, I've dropped back and said, wow, they got a problem.

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They have a degree that enables them to medicate. Statins are a typical drug, right? I mean, hormone replacement therapy. Every woman when she was healthy, leaving her OB -GYN's office, got estrogen and progesterone. Why? To prevent stroke and cancer. The Women's Health Initiative study of 1998 was terminated abruptly when they found that those hormone replacement therapies were increasing women's risk of stroke and cancer.

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Josh Dech - CHN (19:56.818)
Mm -hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (19:57.772)
We were wrong. When I was born, four out of five doctors smoked camels. That was just okay. I mean, now statins, the goal I see of the pharmaceutical industry is to get well people on drugs, lots of drugs, from womb to tomb.

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Josh Dech - CHN (20:15.57)
Wow. Put that on a t -shirt, Doug.

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You know, it's really interesting how wrong medicine has been so much of the time until proven otherwise and they're so happy. This is the unfortunate state of the situation of the industry. Not the doctors. A lot of doctors go to med school, well -meaning, but they do get stuck in a system where they're forced to in many ways prescribe drugs needlessly. Look at thalidomide used for pregnant women in motion sickness or morning sickness. What it ended up doing was causing a ton of birth defects in babies and stillbirths and all kinds of stuff, but it was pushed knowingly.

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Doug Kaufmann (20:19.968)
You

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Josh Dech - CHN (20:46.61)
because there was a financial backing. Even the EPA, when they start looking at which pesticides or herbicides will approve, it actually says on the EPA website that they approve them after considering the economic, financial, and ecological cost -risk -benefit ratios. And so if the people approving this thing, who are getting paid to approve it, decide that the cost to the ecosystem or human life is enough for the economic gain, they'll take it. Well, I'm not benefiting from the economic gain at all.

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Doug Kaufmann (21:14.477)
Right, right. No, no, yeah.

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Josh Dech - CHN (21:14.93)
Not either are you, right? They are. And so we have this 30 % of 200 million, it's probably almost 70 million antibiotic prescriptions every year given unnecessarily. And I'll tell you an interesting story. I went to the dermatologist that was dealing with a really bad acne problem. Back of my gut was really severe. I went to the dermatologist and I said, hey, I'm having acne.

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It's on my back, it's on my neck, down my arms. It's a fungal issue. No question asked. It's a Candida issue. I have the organic acid test. So I got the urine test, which shows my Arabinose. I have the stool test, which actually showed Candida, which is for the listeners. This is a small bowel bacteria or small intestine. And if it's in the large in your stool, you got a problem. I also found a bunch of parasites. And so I went to him and said, look, when I'm stressed, if I don't sleep, when I eat carbs or sugars, alcohol or anything at all, my Candida or my

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acne breaks out even worse.

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It's got to be Candida fungal based. Can you help me with the parasites in the fungus? I have the tests. I have the data. Here's the information. He says to me, says, well, I can give you antibiotics. I said, well, that's going to kill the bacteria and make the fungus worse. He says, I agree. I can also give you a topical cream or I can give you Accutane, which will basically just shut down my skin's ability to reflect or express and detoxify these Candida toxins. So they just be housed inside the body instead. It's okay. But you understand the root cause is fungal and parasites. I'm asking for help with the fungus.

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Doug Kaufmann (22:11.853)
Yeah.

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Josh Dech - CHN (22:36.692)
fungus and parasites. He says, I understand. I'm one of the top dermatologists in the country. I speak on this stuff, but the standard of care says I have these three options. Neither of them are fungal or parasites. And so we're left in this standard of care where even the, we'll call it the pharmaceutical machine, isn't allowing these doctors to get the root cause regardless of whether they recognize it or not.

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Doug Kaufmann (22:59.118)
You are just, see you and I would have been dangerous together. I'll tell you what happened to me. I wrote a book years ago, decades ago, 80 or something, Food Sensitivities.

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Josh Dech - CHN (23:02.386)
Hahaha

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Doug Kaufmann (23:13.709)
And in that I talked about gut hyperpermeability, you chew up the food, it leaks through the gut, you make an antibody response to it and so forth. And I said basically I think even dermal problems are gut problems. Well this yielded a phone call from a guy named David Weakley. Love the guy, but boy was he angry at me. I'm a board certified Johns Hopkins dermatologist. I'm in Dallas, Texas. I lived in LA at the time. And he said I think you're talking out of turn here. Skin problems are not gut problems.

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problems. I invited him to come to LA and see some of what I was doing, which he and his wife came out, were blown away, made me an offer to relocate and come to Dallas for five years on contract and help his psoriasis. He was on the board of psoriasis, national board of psoriasis, important guy. David was such a fascinating guy. I went in,

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four days a month, stayed in an apartment out here and saw his patients. And finally, six months into that, he made me the offer. Josh, it was unbelievable what happened.

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I asked that he prescribe a bloodstream antifungal for psoriasis and a gut antifungal. So either Di -Flucan or Sporinox and Nystatin. And I would put them on a restrictive diet, mostly off of carbs, right? We'd see a two -week follow -up. Some of these patients would emote in two weeks.

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would sit in the room crying and tell Dr. Weekly, this is unbelievable. You've been giving me cortisone and a PUFA box for three years. Why haven't you? And he said, I'm just learning. But the most important part of this for your audience was, yes, their psoriasis got better. The majority of people improved dramatically. But what I call the accoutrements, someone had lymphoma on her neck. Boom.

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Josh Dech - CHN (25:02.682)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (25:20.334)
Others had chronic sinusitis, mycotic acne like you talk about. All of them had stomach problems, bloating, belching, gas, constipation, diarrhea, indigestion, GERD, et cetera. And when Dr. Weekly saw the magnitude of what a doctor could do, he kept saying, but I'm a dermatologist. I can't help the gut. yeah, you can. You know, this was back in the 80s.

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Josh Dech - CHN (25:45.786)
Wow.

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Doug Kaufmann (25:46.669)
It grew and grew and grew. His patients, instead of leaving him and finding a different dermatologist, began referring people to us. And I was so busy, I wouldn't get home, the kids were young at that time, and I wouldn't get home until six or seven at night, drained, going over this same, here's what I want you to eat, can I eat this? And the best part of this was this one builder came in one time with horrible psoriasis, took his shirt off, I couldn't believe it.

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And we had him back at two weeks. He went on my program. Now this is Dallas, Texas. This is Dr. Pepperville. He was a Dr. Pepper addict. And so at two weeks he was doing great. He said, I don't want to change anything. I want to stay whatever these pills are. My bowels are now moving. Everything's going great. And so at his month follow -up, he said, he pulled me aside away from the doctors and said, Doug, I need a Dr. Pepper so bad. And I said, OK.

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Josh Dech - CHN (26:25.176)
Mm -hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (26:42.767)
I want you to go down to 7 -Eleven. This was before cell phones. He went down, he told me the story, me and Dr. Weakley went, ran from his truck back to the doctor. Before he got off the counter, he laid his dollar down on the counter and he said, man, I missed these. He was talking to the lady. He gets in his truck and he goes, whoa, that's horrible. I must've got a bad one. And he went back in the store and said, ma 'am, I'm sorry. I've been drinking Dr. Pepper my whole life.

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And this was a bad one. She said, my gosh, I'm so sorry. Go get yourself another one or two if you want. So I went back and got one. He sat in his truck. And he went to a pay phone and called Dr. Weekly. And he said, you're just not going to believe this for a year. You know where I'm going, Josh, because you get to hear this. The audience may not.

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Josh Dech - CHN (27:28.885)
I know exactly where you're going.

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Doug Kaufmann (27:33.488)
folks we become addictive to certain things smoking you know drinking alcohol etc and we believe it's really good for us because it tastes so good your taste buds your whole physiology changes when you realize the etiology the root cause of what's bugging you is Dr. Pepper is your diet he told that story to patients coming in Dr. Weakley's office

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Dr. Pepper tasted different, now I can't stand the taste of it. And many of us go through that. I, through my 20s, I think I had post -traumatic stress coming out of Vietnam, in my 20s it was a bit of a blur, I drank alcohol because it was okay. And it made me not be so scared. As I look back now, Josh, on those years, I can't stand the taste of alcohol.

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went out with a friend of mine the other day who had a beer and she brought over the table and pops the top and that smell, just made me sick. It wouldn't make any other 75 year old guy sick, but it made me sick. So there are addictions we get into, sugar is another one, they just don't taste the same anymore.

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So as you lean toward good health, your body will respond by saying, well done, high five. And that's what I learned. The fascinating thing, Josh, was these hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of patients. I went on to work. Now doctors in that building began to refer their patients upstairs because we could help them get better on an antifungal program. So many diseases, heart disease, diabetes, cancer. Did you know, Josh, in order to give

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study animals' diabetes. We put them on a couple of mycotoxins, streptozotocin or baphylo myosin, old antibiotics that were too toxic. And all the mice, when we inoculate them over a few weeks, they all get diabetes, right? Their pancreas begins dumping, beta cells are horrible, everything goes awry. But then they can study medications or procedures. To give study animals cancer,

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Doug Kaufmann (29:43.503)
we give them a different mycotoxin. This one's made by Aspergillus mold. It's called aflatoxin. You inoculate animals, bunnies, over a period of time, and you sell to the drug companies all these bunnies that now have cancer that they can test. And to give bunnies...

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the characteristics of dementia and Alzheimer's disease, a different mycotoxin. This one is called Ibotenic acid, and they all end up with neurological problems. Point I want to make is, Josh, you and I would go home to our wives, put our arm around them and say, you're not going to believe this, honey. I just gave 2 ,000 bunnies diabetes. Because our wives would say, how'd you do that? I don't know, it was a little bottle. It was called streptozotosin. Look it up on the computer.

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it's an old antibiotic, it's a mycotoxin. We are giving tens of thousands of animals diseases using fungal metabolites, fungus like you and I breathe, like you and I eat on a regular basis. And we don't equate our diabetes or our cancers or our neurological problems.

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Josh Dech - CHN (30:51.662)
Hehehe

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Doug Kaufmann (30:54.863)
to fungus at all because look, there's 12 anti fung There are 700 antibiotics antivirals. So viruses and b problem. But fungus can c itching, a ringworm on a big deal. It is the big d day I stop breathing, I

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shouting that from the mountaintops. We're giving people fungal problems.

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Josh Dech - CHN (31:29.516)
Yeah, no kidding. You know fungus is really interesting because like you said we don't talk about it But I don't think people are aware that it's fungal like of course you get topical fungal issues Like you mentioned like yeast infection oral thrush There's all kinds of little ways you can get these fungi in there But ultimately where do we get it you mentioned that Candida albicans is a normal part of our guts ecosystem this microbiome it's in there

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and it can overgrow under antibiotics, which is opportunistic. But you did mention mold. Now most people don't associate mold as being a mycotoxin or a mold or a fungal toxin rather. So where are we getting exposed to these toxins and what's causing our normal healthy levels of fungus in the body to overgrow becoming such a problem?

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Doug Kaufmann (32:14.447)
There's so many ways we get these mycotoxins in our body. Now, as a sidebar, certain fungi, there are thought, Josh, to be two million fungi out there. Thus far, we have categorized fewer than 100 ,000. Of those very few, about two to 300 make these poisons. Unfortunately, it is the yeast or the molds or the fungi that we commonly get into. Now, I always tell people it's my...

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you know, consistent advice if you have an allergy. The first thing you have to do, and it's perennial, it's not seasonal, it's year round. First thing you gotta do, just a couple letters, P -I -L -L -O -W. People hit, we spend a third of our lives on a pillow. And when your head hits that pillow,

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And you may have sweat on that pillow. And you may have drool on that pillow. So moisture in that pillow. I can't tell you, Josh, how many people have written me and said, wow, you know, 40 bucks. Thank you, Doug. I don't have allergies any longer. It's to you and me, things like that are quite simple. We are drinking, Michael, alcohol. I went on this morning to the American Heart.

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Josh Dech - CHN (33:19.113)
You

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Doug Kaufmann (33:30.992)
American Diabetes and American Cancer dot org websites, all three of them. First thing pops up, donate. Big red button, donate, give us money. I'm here to find out about this. Give us money and we'll, you know, that has always bothered me that these organizations are fundraisers first. Then I went to the diet and I always type in beer and wine because

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the medical community seems to be fixed on beer and wine. Each of those organizations, now, alcohol is intimately linked to seven common cancers, intimately. IARC has published that alcohol, ethanol, you know, alcohol, mycotoxins are contributed to seven, and yet the American Cancer says, if you drink, get this, Josh, if you drink beer,

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don't drink more than 80 gallons of beer a year. If you, mm -hmm, that's what two beer, they say moderate drinking is two beers a day. I did the math. 80, right? The definition for you and me of alcoholism. But for women, a glass of five ounces, six ounces of wine an evening. And the Diabetes Association even recommends it. You know, that people with diabetes should. It's so unbelievable. Wine,

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Josh Dech - CHN (34:28.23)
80 gallons.

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Josh Dech - CHN (34:35.11)
That's alcoholism, Doug.

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Doug Kaufmann (34:53.775)
If you drink a glass of wine in the evening, women don't understand this because their doctors don't expound on it. Candidly, in all sincerity, they don't understand this. If you drink a glass of wine in the evening, that's 79 bottles of wine a year. Then we go in, Josh, and we say, man, I'm so constipated and then I have diarrhea. And the doctor will say, well, we better run some tests. We don't understand why.

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Josh Dech - CHN (35:10.18)
Doug Kaufmann (35:21.679)
Do you drink alcohol? Yeah, but I drink moderately. I have 80, what is it, 82 gallons of beer a year. How long you been drinking? 10 years. 820, 1000 gallons of beer. Gee, I don't understand why you're bow. Nobody gets it, Josh. Very often, corn, wheat,

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and peanuts. And interestingly enough, pistachios and sunflower seeds are impregnated with this mold, yes, in North America. There with you in Canada and us down here in America. It's not uncommon to have your cereals impregnated with these fungal metabolites. Well, can't you boil it out of pasta? You break the pasta, throw it into a boiling pan of water, and the fungus dies.

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But the mycotoxins that have impregnated that pasta live. There are some studies that say it can live beyond autoclaving. Now you think about that with an endotracheal tube.

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We're cleaning it in an autoclave and then we're putting it in another patient. And you begin to see some of the complexities. Mycotoxins are heat stable. They're dangerous. We now know they hurt the liver, they hurt the kidneys, they hurt the brain, they induce cancer, they lower your immune system. And that's been my study for 50 years. And I'm not done. Every day, Josh, new information comes in. Do you know two and a half years, one and a half years ago?

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Josh Dech - CHN (36:27.169)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (36:51.535)
Weissman Institute of Science in Israel, along with major colleges here in the US, discovered they studied 17 ,000 cancer samples, biopsies, and found that 35 different cancers, brain, breast, prostate, colon, had these fungi in them. All these...

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35 different kinds of cancer are showing the presence of fungus or fungal DNA. And then, Josh, it's gone.

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Your grant has paid you money. It sits on the shelf. I'm the only guy in the world who probably sat there and was floored by this collaborative big research study that said, well, we don't know the clinical significance of this, but in all 35 types of cancer we tested, they all had fungus in them. Do you think that's the cause? No, no, it can't be the cause. We'd have known that. You know, we'd know that. We'd just give them antibiotics.

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It's confusing and yet I must have had the right attitude when God put me in this field because I find it so enjoyable. I got some reports back of people that as an end result of our show you saw. I know how high it is.

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Josh Dech - CHN (37:59.23)
Man.

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Doug Kaufmann (38:19.536)
to see the tears, to have the people say, why have I suffered so long, to put your arm around them and say, suffer no longer. What you and I do, Josh, we don't sell off on switches. We give them volume switches. You can turn your symptoms way down. You can leave them down. Or if you choose, it's your birthday after all. It's Thanksgiving. You can turn the volume way up. And that's basically what you and I do.

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very proud of you, from my friends here, you know, in our little town, to what you're doing on a much larger basis, helping other people understand that sometimes science is wrong. If I had one, if I hear one more time, follow the science, which science? Science of 1950? Science of today? Or science 100 years from now? Come on, guys, we don't know science very well.

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Josh Dech - CHN (39:05.882)
Yeah.

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Josh Dech - CHN (39:14.202)
Man, I appreciate you so much, Doug. You know, when we look at this science, it is ever evolving. That is the definition of science. If nothing is really settled, I mean, how many Nobel prizes are redacted after a decade or two decades and they've changed now because they've learned something new. You know, some things are ever consistent. I mean, Hippocrates said that all diseases begin in the gut. And so I want to share two interesting theories with you about cancers and about alcohol.

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Doug Kaufmann (39:36.175)
right.

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Josh Dech - CHN (39:43.61)
You know, cancer is an interesting theory floating around that the tumors are actually an encapsulation of something that your body's trying to house or protect you from. It's putting into a bubble saying, no, no, no, we don't want this around. Then you biopsy and then they metastasize and go everywhere because you basically pop the bubble. That's theory number one. Theory number two on alcohol.

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Now there's something between the stomach and small intestine. We have these toll -like receptors within the body. I believe there's nine of them. And TLR4, toll -like receptor number four, that sits at the door basically between the stomach and the small intestine. It blocks and decides what will or will not enter. This is where we get this immediate urgency of diarrhea a lot of the time. If somebody eats something they shouldn't, what their body does, the TLR4, these toll -like receptors, open up.

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and say, come on in, get you in, get you out as quick as we possibly can. Cause we want to get rid of you. It's this toxic to our body. So actually opens the cells in the intestines, opens up, creates leaky gut to draw water in. And it's like putting your thumb over the hose to like swash down the driveway, adds pressure in and out. I'm sure somebody listening to this, you've had this experience, you've eaten something, you drank coffee, you had something within 10 minutes, diarrhea. That's your body's TLR4, these toll like receptor number four. They open up.

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Doug Kaufmann (40:44.463)
Yep. Yep.

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Josh Dech - CHN (40:58.935)
floodgates open and it washes out. But what's really interesting with alcohol, if you just took alcohol, what's alcohol used for? Primarily, it's either

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commiseration or celebration, right? Or it's for detoxification and sanitization. And so your gut microbiome is vast. I argue it's as important as our DNA. It actually has regulatory mechanisms for all kinds of things, including your own genetic expression. So it's very important. But did you know, Doug, your toll like receptors, when alcohol comes in, it actually says, no, no, no, no, you're bad for us, but we're not going to let you come through. They actually shut down the absorption of things passing to your small intestine. So instead of letting it get in,

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in contact to kill off your microbiome, my theory is your body recognizes that alcohol is so dangerous to your gut microbiome, it actually allows it to absorb through the stomach, get into your blood, and attack your brain before it lets it get to your gut microbiome.

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Doug Kaufmann (41:49.826)
Wow, wow, wow, I needed to hear that. You asked me did you know? No, I didn't. That's why I love being who I am. I absorb other people's information. Now I've got that and you know me, I'm gonna run back to my office and study all this. On your, right, look it up, on your first issue.

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Josh Dech - CHN (41:56.087)
No, I won't.

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Josh Dech - CHN (42:05.46)
Yeah, looking up, yeah.

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Doug Kaufmann (42:09.997)
Did you know that fungi protect themselves from phagocytosis? Most commonly cryptococcus, bird poop, histoplasmosis, other fungi protect themselves. There is power in numbers. Fungi are capable of weaving a sac, it's called an ascomycete, and growing and reproducing sexually and asexually within that sac.

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So that lump, hmm, doesn't feel like much, but I better go to a doctor. Now a man wouldn't say that, a woman would say that, but 1 plus percent of all new breast cancers are in men. So a guy would stand in the shower and go, hmm, that's a little tender. Nah, six months later, ooh, gosh, that's getting a little bigger.

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I'm telling you, I think we are misdiagnosing ascomycetes, sac fungi, mysotomas, sac fungi as cancer. What are the similarities? Here's cancer and here's an ascomycete. The similarities are amazing. Everybody knows these can grow in your body, tumors, without oxygen. So do ascomycetes.

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Josh Dech - CHN (43:02.452)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (43:21.072)
Everybody knows that the antifungal drug Sporinox will not only prevent this from metastasizing, but it will induce cancer cell apoptosis. Sporinox is a toenail fungus drug. This one thrives on sugar. This one dies in the absence of sugar. This one responds to Sporinox. These off -gas VOCs, volatile organic compounds.

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Josh Dech - CHN (43:41.123)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (43:49.391)
You begin to look at this and you make such a brilliant point. By the way, the medical community totally disagree with you and me on this, so I want your viewers to know this. The information I have looked at through the years, biopsy doesn't hurt, it can't, when you pop a balloon, poof, what's inside the balloon is dispersed. When you pop an Ascomycete, the Ascospores, the fungi are gonna get out. They travel quite quickly to areas of warmth.

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Josh Dech - CHN (43:56.624)
100 % yeah.

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Doug Kaufmann (44:18.192)
You know, we got to do an MRI. I found 17 lymph nodes that are just, it is not coincidental at all that we are hyper diagnosing cancer. You begin to look at some of our cancer tests. Did you know the PSA was named wrong? It's not prostate specific. Pregnant women have high PSAs. They don't own a prostate. How accurate is it? Not accurate at all. In the old days, gosh, I met the doctor when I was in

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Vietnam in 1970 that invented the PSA didn't work so he shelved it but he wrote a book called the great prostate hoax man he names names this book I'm shocked that he never got in trouble on that but it tells the story of that we now know that mammograms show about a 22 % false negative and a 20 % false positive 44 minus 100 56 percent accurate

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When you and I got a 56 % in high school on a paper, was it an A? We don't question these things. We don't question our doctors, you know, are important. We're going to go to our doctor. And I think, Josh, when I got back in Vietnam, I started taking my dad to various doctors. They told him he had cancer, so they took his leg off. Then they took his hip out. Then they put a pacemaker in.

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Josh Dech - CHN (45:20.077)
Mm -hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (45:44.624)
Then he had prostate problems. Dad was a drinker. He's a World War II guy. You know, they drank quite a bit, most of them. And from watching that, from observing that, I realized I don't want to smoke. Dad did. I don't want to drink alcohol. Fast foods were brand new back then. I don't want to eat hamburgers from these places. I want to see if I can get to be 60 years old without a doctor. And I did it.

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I'm now 75 here in a few weeks and I don't have a doctor. Now I wake up in the morning like everybody does and go, And I think, man, the kids birthday party. I had two pieces of cake, because it was a big cake, and a little bowl of ice cream. And I induced that pain myself. Two days, it'll be gone. That's not America. Man, we got an ache and pain in our family who love us very much. Get to a doctor immediately and get to the best doctor.

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Get to the guy who chairs the department because he's written 32 papers on doxorubicin, a chemotherapy drug. What do you think he's gonna give you? It just boggles my mind as I step out of the frame in medicine. I don't belong in there. One day, I'll need a doctor. Several people have said to me, how do you know you don't have prostatitis? I sleep at night.

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I can sit in the car and drive long periods. When we go to a doctor for routine physicals, don't get me started, Josh, don't get me started. Doctors are brilliant people, twice my IQ. But you know, you're gonna get a lot of testing done, there's gonna be an anomaly on...

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serum protein or cholesterol or glucose and all of the sudden you're in the loop and that's a loop I have chosen now for 54 years to stay out of. I was in that loop, I worked in that loop and I know that mistakes happen.

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Josh Dech - CHN (47:41.365)
Hehehehe

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Josh Dech - CHN (47:50.279)
Mm hmm. Yeah, it's really interesting. One of the leading causes, statistically speaking of death or medically related death in the USA is going to be from pharmaceuticals or other drugs that are given either needlessly or artificially or whatever they may be. And it's really interesting you bring this up because we go to our doctor.

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And this is where I have a big problem with the Westernized medical system. In the United States, 90 to 92 % depends who you ask. We'll call it 90 % of Americans are not metabolically healthy. Now I define metabolism as any chemical process really used to maintain life. We often hear metabolism as weight gain or weight loss, but it's how your body maintains everything from hair growth to sleep to waking to bowel movements. It's all metabolic activity. But interestingly enough,

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If you go and get your blood work done in Dallas, Texas and Houston, Texas, one might have a flag, one might not, because the general average of these blood labs is based on the general population. Well, if 90 % of them are sick and you're quote normal, that means you are also sick because the average they're using is for sick people. And so blood work itself is a fallacy when we look at these diagnoses and it really brings people down to this place where if it's not so broke,

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then we don't fix it. It'd be like falling off a motorcycle and your arm's hanging on by a thread and they're like, well, when it comes off, then we'll reattach it. Like, it wouldn't make any sense or your bones just crack. So come back when it's fully broken, then we'll cast you. And so you have all these people in this gray area waiting for a diagnosis as if this diagnosis will explain what's wrong with them.

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Doug Kaufmann (49:11.631)
Right.

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Doug Kaufmann (49:16.751)
Yeah.

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Doug Kaufmann (49:25.839)
You hit the nail, thank you, that was eloquent. I have a friend who does anything for free. A new dentist moved into my little town here and put up a sign, free dental cleaning. Okay, she went, got a free dental cleaning. What comes after a dental cleaning? The dentist comes in. This friend of mine has never had a cavity in her life, beautiful white teeth.

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Josh Dech - CHN (49:29.158)
Thank you.

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Doug Kaufmann (49:53.295)
He told her he found six small cavities that if she has the time, he could fix those right now. Fortunately, she said, I got a lunch date with someone, but I'll call your office man. OK. Next day, she went to her own dentist, checked her out. Nada. There are no free lunches, people. Be very careful out there. Things are going on in medicine right now that I don't think have ever gone on. Number two, another friend.

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Josh Dech - CHN (49:59.622)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (50:20.783)
who just sent me, and I don't know why people pay a doctor $800 to evaluate their chem, CBC, differential and then come to me for free and I'll look at it. It was bad, I'm telling you. I know this person and as I looked at this, I kept thinking, boy, this is bad. So when she contacted me, she said, could I ask your take? I'm sorry to have you do this. I know people are asking you. And I said, I'm gonna respond really quickly.

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Josh Dech - CHN (50:30.47)
Thank you.

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Doug Kaufmann (50:50.843)
go to their laboratories in your town that you can go in and have blood drawn and they'll do a chem CBC on you. Get it repeated. It's an inexpensive test. Get it repeated. So she talked to me just the other day and said, you're not going to believe this. The lab that I just had it done on, the new results, everything was within normal limits. This begs...

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This begs a really interesting question. If the monster has so many heads and is so big, do they dip the heads into other fields? Are we seeing laboratory tests come back?

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with all the earmarks of needing medications. And who's winning from that?

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Josh Dech - CHN (51:39.59)
Would it be so crazy to believe that a software developer creates a virus and then sells you the antivirus software?

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Doug Kaufmann (51:45.295)
I'm telling you, I'm telling you Josh, my mind plays tricks on me like that all the time. I keep my mouth shut unless I'm on your podcast. Right, exactly. But I just think evil is out there, hence, do you know, I had no idea what my PSA is. I'm 75, dad had prostate disease.

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Josh Dech - CHN (51:53.446)
Say whatever you want here, that's fine.

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Doug Kaufmann (52:06.639)
And the doctor friends of mine just can't believe that. So one of them, and he couldn't believe, you've never had MFTHR, you know, you've never had the methylation. No, what's your cholesterol? It's always been high. Back in the old days, I used to take my own cholesterol and it's like 225. And he said, wow, well, how about if I pay and I run all these specialized tests on you, PSA and everything. And I said, you're gonna become a, he said, you're gonna become a patient of mine. I said, okay, it's free, I'll do it.

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Here's a guy who has lived a life void of medical intervention. And everything, I'm not a methylator, I guess I'm one of 20 % of Americans who's not. My PSA was low. Of course, Josh, I knew what to do. Before I had all those seven vials of blood taken, I went on a bit of an intermittent fast. I didn't put sugar or carbs in my body, I ate eggs.

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And the only thing, if people only knew, if they only knew, you don't drink a biggie size soda and then go to a doctor.

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My dad used to say, we're in a mill of a house in North America. We are going to way too many doctors. We're getting way over prescribed, way too many lab tests, way too many medications. And then we drop back in a hospital at 68 years old and say, how did I get in here? Gee, I don't know. And that's, I'm unique. I'm a one off. I'm gonna see if I, my goal is to make it 68 without going to a doctor.

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I'm now 75. My next goal is to see if I can make it to 78 without a doctor. At some time I'm going to die, you know, we're mere mortals, and then we'll see if a doctor will take me. But until that time I have saved, I've never used Medicare. I got to get out of jail free card. I've never used it. I don't know what insurance is all about. But...

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Doug Kaufmann (54:11.056)
I know that once people start going to the doctor, I think many times, certainly disease intervention, we have to consider that.

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But why are we diseased in the first place? And that's where guys like you and I think outside of the box. Are we eating ourselves in the IBS, Crohn's disease, cancer, diabetes, every other metabolic mystery? Yeah, I think we are. So watch what you eat.

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Josh Dech - CHN (54:39.257)
Hmm. Well, Doug, I know we're wrapping up. Our time together is always way too short whenever we have a chance to connect. But I would love to ask. I mean, I know you recommend often times to either clients that maybe you're seeing or people that you've worked with to say, yeah, maybe get some niacinamide, or some kind of antifungal. Unfortunately, a lot of doctors will give you seven to 10, maybe 14 days, and that's that.

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Doug Kaufmann (54:45.616)
That's true.

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Josh Dech - CHN (55:03.833)
On the other hand, some functional doctors will give it to you for 8 to 12 months as long as they're monitoring liver function and blood work to make sure you're okay. If somebody thinks they might be dealing with a fungal issue, is there any prep work they need to do before doing antifungals? Do they need to work on a drainage protocol for their liver and kidneys and clean things out? Or do they just jump on the drugs and hope for the best?

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Doug Kaufmann (55:10.416)
Mm -hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (55:20.816)
Right.

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Doug Kaufmann (55:25.456)
Instead of the drugs, we'll think outside of the box a little. On my website, knowthecause .com, if you pull down Getting Started, the bottom link is Doctors Fungal Protocol.

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I did that because so many people are saying, well, I went to my doctor, you know, I have chronic sinusitis, which the Mayo Clinic said is all linked to fungus. And my doctor said, no, that's not true, but your antibiotics aren't helping. So I wrote up this little thing referencing the CDC and all this information about fungus. Two pages, copy, it's free. Take it to your doctor, let him or her review it. Not many doc...

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On top of learning the methotrexate is safe and antibiotics and birth control and you know, on top of learning all that, doctors learned that antifungals are just dangerous. They're going to kill. And I've had a bunch of doctors on my show and then we ran a tape of them. I asked them the question, are you using antifungals more than I ever have in my life and I'm learning so much? Have you seen one elevated liver enzyme? Have you seen liver toxicity? None after years of using them.

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Josh Dech - CHN (56:30.617)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (56:32.178)
So, depending on how deep your mycosis is, ringworm is, you know, a local mycosis, a local fungal problem. But liver cancer, hepato -carcinoma, we now know is intimately linked to fungus, specifically aspergillus fungus, and it's poison called aflatoxin.

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So trying to talk a doctor into giving you an antifungal is difficult, but here's the good news. Again, God made no mistakes. I read an article a few years ago that cinnamon, USP, pharmaceutical grade cinnamon, was as potent, or when fluconazole didn't work, when diflucan, the one pill vaginal yeast pill, didn't work, cinnamon seemed to work. Sulfurofan, I did a lecture to doctors on phytonutrition, plant nutrition, sulfurofan.

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zero -trol, etc. And I'm telling you, Josh, if we only knew the right supplements at the health food store, they would include those that inhibit or kill yeast.

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Things like resveratrol, things like sulfurophane, things like niacin, vitamin B3, things like cholecalciferol, vitamin D3, things that you can buy for almost nothing at a health food store. If the doctor won't, if you're on fire now wanting to get started with an antifungal program, start with an antifungal diet, right? I published this in the 1970s, and it's still good today, called the Kauffman diet. Start on that.

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and ask the doctor if you won't give me Sporonox, which is now FDA approved to treat cancer, and all it does is kill toenail fungus. Gee, I wonder if there's a correlation there. If he won't give you that, if he won't give you Nystatin, a safe gut antifungal, then you need to do a little research. And we have these machines called computers with databases that are libraries.

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Doug Kaufmann (58:32.432)
Look into caprylic acid or monolaurin. These are coconut oil dry fatty acids. Don't rule out omega -3 fatty acids. You see fatty acids happen to kill fungus. Don't rule out lactobacilli species of bacteria like probiotics that just happen to be anti -fungal. You get on a good healthy program and you'll learn what Josh teaches us. Once you pass that area in a few weeks,

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Josh Dech - CHN (58:45.765)
Hmm.

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Doug Kaufmann (59:02.386)
of really getting up there, stay up there with the right nutrition and the right fungi. But unless they have a very dangerous advanced stage disease, I encourage people, we don't call it cheating, we call it challenging. I encourage people to go to a birthday party and have a piece of cake because your brain is that good.

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Your doctor doesn't see this because he can't go home with you. You get to sleep with you every night. You'll see that the next day, gosh, I'm laying in bed, my pulse is racing. What in the world? And I get up, man, I got to get up twice to go to the bathroom at night. And when I get up, my hip is, your doctor can't put those together. You can. There's plenty of cake left over. Do you want more the next day? Again.

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What I teach people is they have a rheostat. They don't have an off -on switch. I can't turn cancer off. But we can probably add years to your life by understanding that we give cancer to animals by giving them fungal conditions.

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Josh Dech - CHN (01:00:10.775)
It's amazing. Doug, you are a wealth of information. You've been doing this longer than I've been alive, which is really impressive. I mean, props to you.

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Doug Kaufmann (01:00:16.432)
I know. That used to be young. I'm not going to quit it. It's too good. You know, I've got a TV show that goes into, what, 180 countries, and I have been blessed. Helping others, and you're really good at that, helping others is such a joy.

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Josh Dech - CHN (01:00:36.78)
Doug, if someone wants to learn more about you, I mean you're everywhere all at the same time, where can they look the easiest place to get a hold of you?

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Doug Kaufmann (01:00:45.328)
Know the Cause, K -N -O -W, knowthecause .com. There you can get the TV stations, books that I've written, I've written a dozen books, and just move around. I have a doctor on our staff here who writes every month updated fungal information. So educate yourself on the website. You don't have to spend a dime. All the information is on there.

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Josh Dech - CHN (01:01:09.74)
That's amazing. Thank you so much for your contribution to the community to health as a general whole. There is so much of it out there that I mean, you're kind of one of the grandfathers of this functional medicine stuff, whether people recognize that or not, that you really attacked root cause and fungus before it was mainstream. You talked about the gut bacteria and the microbiome really before it was mainstream. And so this really is root cause grassroots type of stuff. So thank you for laying the foundation for the rest of us to at least get our hands in the dirt and get moving on it.

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Doug Kaufmann (01:01:39.152)
My honor to be with you. Thank you so much.