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Josh (09:10.149)
Sage Workinger, welcome to Reversible. Pleasure to have you here and to get my nerds all wixed up and finally get them out of my mouth.

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Sage Workinger (09:17.403)
Yeah. Thank you for having me. I'm very excited to be invited.

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Sage Workinger (09:28.663)
My nerds.

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Josh (09:30.02)
Now Sage, for our guests, our listeners who might not be familiar with you, I really wanna anchor this conversation because your name, I don't think you get your credit, I don't think you get your due, which is why you're here. And so, yeah, I know it's funny, because I found you obviously through Gary, because I've been following Gary for some time. And I saw some of your content, I was like, why don't we talk to her instead? So can you?

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Sage Workinger (09:41.175)
Thank you.

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Sage Workinger (09:51.958)
Thank you. I wish I was better at social media, so more people like you would find me, but one of these days I'll get that going. But yeah, terrible.

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Josh (10:00.292)
me too. I'm a nightmare at social, but let's let's find out who you are because you got some interesting stuff in your back pocket. You have a remarkable story in a history and you're actually the co -founder of what I see to be one of the largest health organizations on planet Earth, at least making one of the biggest dents in the health and pharmaceutical industry on planet Earth, which I think is amazing. So who the hell are you?

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Sage Workinger (10:24.465)
Yeah. So my name is Sage and I am the co -founder of what used to be Streamline Medical Group. We started a little clinic in Naples, Florida called Streamline. And then we were operating under Streamline for about five years. And then Gary and I decided to merge with Grant Cardona, Brandon Dawson, and we formed 10X Health System. And so for the last two years, we've been growing 10X Health.

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And it has been quite the journey for sure. Any entrepreneur will feel that from me, the ups and downs of growing a business, but not just growing a business, but growing a business that is looking to really disrupt what the norm is. And we've taken on the health and wellness space in a way that nobody else has done because it's hard. It is hard to do what we're doing because...

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Every state has a different set of laws, a different set of rules, a different set of requirements. You know, for instance, in California, it finally got easier. The list of what could be sent to California was a shorter list than what couldn't be sent to California. And, you know, I commend California on some of the things that they're doing, like banning red food dye in children's food.

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But some things I do not agree with, like not being able to ship a good form of B12 or glutathione. So there's, every state has a different set of rules and trying to tackle that and open up clinics across the country has been a challenge in what we want to do. But it's been an awesome journey and we've...

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had incredible people come to us because we're all on the same mission and that mission is really to help people live longer, happier, healthier lives without the use of pharmaceuticals as much as possible.

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Josh (12:26.112)
Health span, not lifespan. Really, yeah, I love that.

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Sage Workinger (12:28.114)
Correct, yes. What's the point of living a long life if you're not gonna be healthy and happy?

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Josh (12:34.174)
Well, I mean, what is it? 60 plus percent of all Americans over 50, 60 years old are on two or more prescription drugs. It's crazy. And so I mean, the health span, the quality of life, I think we've so normalized this really awful decline. It used to be after 50, 60. Now I'd argue it's after 30 and 40 where people are getting aches and pains and insomnia and anxiety. And there was a recent study that came out. I think it was 70 something percent of all.

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adults between like was 20 and 25 years old, don't quote me on the exact stats, are unfit for military service in the USA due to obesity, anxiety, depression, mental health conditions and all kinds where they are so sick. They are dysfunctional where the military is like, no, dude, we don't want you. It's wild.

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Sage Workinger (13:11.055)
Bye.

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Sage Workinger (13:16.575)
Yeah. It's, I, and you know, it's cause we've got like, well, I did a drive with my daughter from Colorado to Florida. And that, that whole section of middle America is just, you drive through these little towns, there's fast food is the only option for food. I mean, there was literally a town, we drove through multiple towns in a row and we could not find an actual restaurant. It was only fast food options. And I remember laughing because I've never taken my daughter who's now almost 16 to McDonald's.

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And she was like, I am craving a burger. I need a Big Mac. And I was like, no, you don't. Just hold out. And she was like, no, I need a Big Mac. And so she had never had one before. I went ahead and took her. And the next day she was so sick. So, I know, right? She was so ill and she was like, I will never do that again. And then she started thinking like, this is what all my friends do.

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Josh (13:51.741)
Hahaha!

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Josh (14:03.037)
I don't mean to laugh this poor girl.

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Mm -hmm.

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Sage Workinger (14:15.595)
all my friends eat at McDonald's. How are they doing this? And she's just been lucky that she grew up in a family that don't do fast food. I mean, here and there, there might be some Chick -fil -A or Chipotle on a special occasion, but she, I can't eat any of that stuff, but she'll do it every once in a while. But yeah, that Big Mac took her down.

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Josh (14:34.609)
Yeah. I bet I had a client years back. We worked on her gut, worked on her health. She lost like 50 pounds, 60 pounds, did great, gave into a craving, went with her family to A &W three days to recover from a burger. It's amazing what the body is capable of doing when you train it to feel like crap and then it performs like crap. And so really the core of what you do through 10X is making people not feel like crap for longer.

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Sage Workinger (14:42.73)
Mm -hmm.

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Sage Workinger (14:47.946)
Doesn't surprise me.

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Sage Workinger (14:54.826)
Yeah. Yeah.

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Josh (15:03.609)
so they can have better, healthier lives and just be human beings, which I think is great. And so walk me through this Sage, what do you think is at the root of all health and wellness? Obviously we talk about the gut and all things connected to gut, but what is the driving force you feel that keeps people healthy? You mentioned methylation, do you believe it's genetics, DNA, is it gut health? What's the root of it?

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Sage Workinger (15:25.162)
I'm a huge believer in balancing your methylation. I didn't have any idea what that word meant four years ago, but until it affected me so tremendously. And you know, when you're talking about like people being on all these pharmaceuticals, even in their thirties and forties, the same thing almost happened to me. And all it was, was I, in November, 2019, I went to the grocery store. I was picking up the multivitamin, like gummy kids multivitamin for my daughter. Thankfully I was picking up the right version for her.

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But I grabbed one of the ultra women's multivitamins that like lined the shelves. It seems like everybody's taking this. This must be a popular one because it's everywhere. So I picked one of those up and I started taking this multivitamin. And over the course of the next four months, I slowly turned into a crazy person. And I had to start, my anxiety went through the roof. I was severely depressed. My gut was a complete mess. Like.

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gas, bloating, diarrhea, constipation. It was all over the place. I couldn't figure out what was going on. I was having heartburn. I'd never had heartburn before. And I was having heartburn like to the point where I could barely swallow. But ultimately all of that led to, I was having suicidal thoughts. That was the scariest symptom of what I was going through. But ultimately it culminated into my first panic attack. And when that happened, Gary and I had been together for five years.

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I think the business was almost three, maybe four years old at the time. And he was like, okay, this is not who you are. We've never seen this from you before. Something is wrong. We got to figure this out. So he ran every test in the book on me. And we sat down with all the doctors that we could and said, okay, I've got lab core results that say my B12 levels are through the roof. Like not even measurable.

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but at a, we did a cellular nutrition assay test and at a cellular level, I was almost completely deficient in B12. So I was like, okay, well, one of these tests is wrong. And it was the light bulb moment that went off for Gary. Sorry, I'm gonna turn my, I'm at my parents' house. Look how cute it is. It is, I love their house, it's comforting. But that was the light bulb moment for Gary where he was like, no, this makes perfect sense. You're taking in a form of B12 that you can't process and.

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Josh (17:26.965)
Hmm.

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Josh (17:36.021)
It's very precious.

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Sage Workinger (17:50.438)
And you're, you know, it's just like you're not absorbing it into your cells. And so it's not working for you. It's actually a detriment. And so we slowly learned then with the methylation test that I have these breaks that don't allow me to process cheap synthetic forms of vitamins. And the two specific vitamins that were in there that were synthetic forms were cyanocobalamin, which is a cheap B12, and folic acid, which is cheap vitamin B9.

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And what I really need is either methylcobalamin or hydroxycobalamin as my B12, which is a natural form, or adenosylcobalamin. You'll never see that because it's too expensive. And I need folate or five -methylfolate because I can't, I don't have the ability to convert folic acid into five -methylfolate. So when we looked, when we were like, okay, well, where am I getting these vitamins from? I looked at my cabinet, I went in my pantry.

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and I had sky high levels of cyanocobalamin, the cheap B12, and folic acid in that multivitamin. But in addition to that, I'm taking, I won't use brand names because I've gotten in trouble for using brand names, but think of energy drinks, think of products that are supposed to be like giving an IV, right? And then fortified foods. And I was waking up having cereal, eating bagels.

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Josh (19:09.009)
Fortified foods, yeah.

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Sage Workinger (19:17.793)
I'd have crackers for lunch, you know, I'm eating a sandwich. And so I'm having all of these breads and carbs that have folic acid sprayed on them. And I, you know, am taking these products from the shelves and they have cyanocobalamin in them. So I was a complete disaster. As soon as I learned that about myself and I stopped taking the multivitamin and I cut all of that stuff out of my diet, my gut went back to normal. My anxiety came down. I was no longer like,

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fighting for my life basically. But during that time I saw a therapist and that therapist was like, you need prescription medication. You need anti -anxiety medication, you need antidepressants, you need Xanax. She wrote me five different prescriptions and I remember I took it to CVS and I was ready to fill these five prescriptions. Because I'm a rule follower, it's part of my comp tea break, but.

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I'm a rule follower and I'm like, the doctor told me to take this, I need to take it. But it was when it hit me that I'm like, I'm 30 something years old, why would I start taking all of this? I've never taken medication in my life and now I'm supposed to take five medications to make me feel better? This doesn't make sense. And it also is because I was too poor to be able to afford the prescriptions, so I didn't fill them when I found out how much they cost, because we were struggling at the time. And thank God I didn't because...

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I didn't need them. All I needed to do was change my diet and add in the right raw materials by taking the right form of vitamins and adding in the right diet items and I've been great ever since. So.

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Josh (20:58.355)
So I want to back it up because while we were on this call, right live right now, the second I took a poll of my audience and 217 % of them have no idea what methylation is. Now I didn't take a live poll. I made that up, but that's my guess. So let's back things up a little bit Sage. You were so impressed for a minute. 217 % is a very accurate number of my audience poll. So we have the word methylation.

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Sage Workinger (21:13.82)
I was like, we're live? I didn't realize that. That's cool.

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Felt good.

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Josh (21:25.835)
That's something you're deficient in, you're having an issue in, you mentioned CompT. So I want to back it up and add some context for our listeners. First of all, what on earth is methylation? Why is it important?

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Sage Workinger (21:35.865)
The easiest way to explain it is that methylation is the process by which we take in a raw material and we convert it into a usable form. And my favorite example, I have two favorite examples that Gary taught me and helped me understand this better. So the first example is the crude oil. So you cannot take crude oil out of the ground and put it right into your gas tank. You have to refine it into gasoline so that the engine understands that fuel source.

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Methylation is the refining process. So you take in a raw material through diet supplementation, and then your body has to methylate or convert it into the usable form that your body recognizes. So you take in the form of B12, and it converts into energy that your body can use. The other thing that I always use as an example when I'm talking with people that have had their genetic methylation test done is the chocolate chip cookie example.

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Think of methylation like, you know, I give you a chocolate chip cookie, but I don't give you all the right raw materials to make the recipe. I don't give you brown sugar. I don't give you eggs. I don't give you, you know, the flour. It's not your fault. I didn't give you the right raw materials to make the recipe. But if I give you all the right raw materials, you've got your butter and your chocolate chips and all the things, then you're going to make an excellent chocolate chip cookie. So the great thing about methylation is that...

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Some of the genes that we test for there are five main genes that we test for and we call them actionable genes and the reason they're important is Because most of your genes you're born with you die with you can't change I can't change my eye color unless I put contacts in I can't change my hair color also diet which is probably coming up here soon and but I But I with these five actionable genes if you are have a mutation that's either passed on from one parent or both parents

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Josh (23:22.437)
Hehehehe

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Sage Workinger (23:33.461)
and that gene isn't functioning at 100%, you can add in the right raw materials to make it function to 100%. But you have to do it every day, because your body metabolizes through whatever you eat or supplement with every day. So I always tell people, like, I can't skip a day of vitamins. I will notice it in my gut. I will notice it in my mental state. But it really is, you know, once you get your protocol right and you get things in balance, it is incredible how many...

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disease symptoms that it solves. I mean, and I always say, I'm not a doctor. I am not a medical provider. I have zero background. I can talk like this much about it, but I can share my story at least in the majority of the time. I'm talking to people that know what I'm talking about because they're suffering with the same stuff. So that did that kind of answer your question.

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Josh (24:23.104)
Yeah.

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I think that's brilliant. So the process of methylation is taking unusable materials, converting them into usable materials that your body can actually break down, digest, absorb and utilize. Yeah, like that's brilliant. I described the body as it's a city.

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Sage Workinger (24:38.003)
Yes.

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Josh (24:41.73)
And within it, we have all these factories. All of our organ systems are factories and all the cells are the factory workers. Well, the factory workers to do their job need tools, vitamins, minerals, nutrients, amino acids. And so this methylation process is actually part of the tool manufacturing, which the workers need to do their jobs. That's beautiful. OK, feel free to steal that. I put it on a T -shirt. No big deal. So we've got this this methylation. OK, so.

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Sage Workinger (24:58.034)
Yes. Yeah. I like it. I'm going to write that down.

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Josh (25:10.241)
I have to ask that so methylation or the extraction of raw materials and conversion to useful materials. How is that impacting the rest of the body? So you mentioned you had all these symptoms coming up. You mentioned you had anxiety and suicidal thoughts and gut issues. If we don't have proper methylation. Okay, first of all, how do we know if we have a methylation issue? Do we have to test? Can we go through symptoms? Second follow up to that would be how do we fix it?

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Sage Workinger (25:38.385)
So there's an easy test that you can take. It's just a cheek swab. We do it through 10X Health. There are other companies out there in case people are not within the US, because we are not shipping that test internationally yet. So there's a simple gene test that we test for these five markers, MTHFR, which I lovingly call. You can bleep this out, but call it the motherfucker gene, because... Okay, good, yes.

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Josh (26:03.552)
You can say it. We all call it the motherfucker gene.

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Sage Workinger (26:08.304)
because it's mind and gut related. MTR and MTRR, MTR is very much lower gut type symptoms. MTRR is more upper gut symptoms in addition to thyroid issues, high blood pressure issues. And I also call that the snappy temper gene. That's when people go like maybe calm, calm, calm, and then zero to a hundred, like, you know, like that. And it's hard to get them back in balance and calm.

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And then there's the AHCY is a genetic break that's very rare. I have it so I can relate to it if anybody has that gene break. But a lot of times that has issues with addiction and very much related to like dopamine levels, serotonin levels. And then CompT, usually CompT has to do again, it's more mind related. CompT is usually like type A personality.

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very much like perfectionists, people that suffer with ADD, ADHD, OCD. Yeah, we're usually, you know, if somebody's yellow, yellow means that they, it's operating at about 40%. They only got the mutation from one parent. If they got it from both parents and they're red, then they're like, you know, severe, can be severe OCD.

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Josh (27:13.885)
Me.

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Sage Workinger (27:33.516)
hyper, hyper perfectionist. It's very much the consummate overachiever profile where you hold yourself to a very high standard and then you hold other people to that standard too and you're disappointed constantly in people that don't meet your standards. And so...

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Josh (27:48.732)
Sounds like therapists and marriage counselors need this test. Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (27:51.788)
Very much so. Yeah, they usually have that break. They're not, they're always entrepreneurs because they don't like to be micromanaged. They don't like to be told what to do. And so they usually run companies on their own because they don't like working for other people. So is your closet super, super organized too?

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Josh (28:10.203)
so I'm a disaster. My wife, if you've ever watched Brooklyn Nine -Nine, I'm Jake, she's Amy Santiago. And so, you're missing out. I'm telling you, it's one of the funniest shows of all time. It's seconds to the office only. And so...

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Sage Workinger (28:12.519)
okay.

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Sage Workinger (28:17.868)
I haven't watched it, but now I'm gonna need to. Okay.

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Sage Workinger (28:24.843)
Okay.

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Josh (28:26.17)
She everything's spreadsheet everything's organized. She'll go through every couple weeks and redo her closet and make my side I just I throw stuff up top. I ball my clothes. My desk is a disaster. I could have I could have stuff and clothes piled up. I would literally pile up clothing behind my door, right? I imagine it does. It'll get a foot and a half behind my door where I have to like shuffle sideways to get to the bathroom and I'm like, I'll get to it later. It's not a priority right now. I'm super mellow but super forgetful ADHD.

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Sage Workinger (28:31.883)
Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (28:39.787)
That's the next week's tweet.

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Sage Workinger (28:55.786)
Yeah. Okay. So yeah, so in, and some of that is like, like maybe you don't have the comp T piece, but you may have the Okay. So it's like a sandbag pass. And so if you don't give MTHFR at the bottom, okay, just think of it like you don't give the first guy a hundred pounds of sand, you can only give 40 pounds of sand or 10 pounds of sand or zero. Well, then the rest of the chain is affected. So even if you

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Josh (28:55.866)
with addictive tendencies.

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Sage Workinger (29:22.824)
don't have some of the upper breaks, it can be, they can be activated. They like turning that gene on and off. You can activate it because the ones below it are activated. So a lot of times I see like MTRR is red, especially when that's red. Even if someone above it has, they have green, they, you know, it's supposed to be functioning at a hundred percent the CompT and the AHCY. They still have symptoms of those.

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breaks because the one below it is operating at zero. And so it all it's just this like chain. So if you can fix it, the lower you can fix it, the better and, and it calms it all down. But yeah, for somebody, I got all kinds of solutions for ADHD. Because I

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Josh (30:08.439)
I love how you led this conversation with like, well, I only know this much and I'm not a healthcare provider, but here you are blowing me out of the water. Like, this is great. I'm, yeah.

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Sage Workinger (30:16.103)
Because I live with it. I'm like the vitamin Nazi in my house because I know everybody's things. And ultimately this methylation test is a personality test. And I'm like, okay, I can understand if you got a tummy ache or something and we can correct that. But if this is like, I always tell people, think about what you put in your mouth. How is that not only affecting your gut, but how is it affecting your mental state? And nobody ever thinks of it like that.

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Josh (30:21.879)
Mm.

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Sage Workinger (30:44.518)
But if you're off here, then you're for sure off in your gut. That's a gut, total gut -mind connection. And nobody really thinks about that. So if you can correct what's happening in your gut, it will solve the things that are happening up in your head too.

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Josh (31:00.852)
Yeah, I mean personally I've dealt with, I've got parasites. I've actually tested for those, which in my opinion, parasite testing we know is very difficult. They can burrow, they can hide, they get into muscles. I actually tested positive, which means A, I got really lucky, or B, they're just falling out of me because they're crowded up like a Hong Kong high -rise tower. On the other hand, I've also got Candida, which has been highly problematic. I recently found out I've been getting Acneum like this is a problem, brain's going off.

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Sage Workinger (31:04.133)
Okay.

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Sage Workinger (31:18.213)
I'm gone.

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Josh (31:27.539)
I so just recently here I had purchased because the Stuyvesant organic market down the road and they just recently got a ton of apples that were on sale seven bucks a bag. So I was eating like ten apples a day took about two weeks. I started getting constipated blood in the stool. I'm like, okay, I've got a problem. That's how I actually found my parasites was high fiber diet and did some more symptomatology. And so I have to know go through and get all these guys out. But I believe.

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Sage Workinger (31:42.116)
Mmm.

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Sage Workinger (31:48.196)
Gotcha.

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Josh (31:51.859)
I do have some of these genetic breaks you're talking about. I believe I mean what 44 % of the population I believe has a mthfr gene issue.

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Sage Workinger (32:00.771)
We actually read a study from last year that said it's more in the 80s. I thought it was, it was, yeah, 80s, 80%. Yeah. The majority. I know, I know. It's like, but it's so tricky because like, it's cool that we've really stumbled across this methylation piece because it's not really talked about much. Even my girlfriend that I was telling you about earlier who works in a hospital, I was talking to her about the right.

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Josh (32:05.746)
80s.

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Wow, y 'all gonna have to change your website.

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Sage Workinger (32:30.755)
raw materials that this child that she's working with needs. And guess what form of B12 they have in the hospital? It's cyanocobalamin. Yeah, it's terrible. If they gave that to this child who's got Crohn's disease and gut issues, it's gonna make it a hundred times worse. And that's what we're doing is like, but this is, methylation is new. It's...

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Josh (32:38.738)
20 bucks is at Cyanocobalamin, yep, the cheapest cyanide bound.

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Josh (32:49.201)
Sure.

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Sage Workinger (32:55.394)
It's not new, it's just not been talked about. But again, it's not going to be talked about a lot by the medical community because if I can tell you that I didn't need, I'm gonna always say I, I didn't need to take antidepressants or anti -anxiety medications or Xanax because I fixed my issues with the right diet and supplementation, that's not a moneymaker for Big Pharma. So it's gonna be a minute until this becomes the norm.

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but we're on a mission to get that out to everybody.

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Josh (33:26.031)
Yeah. Well, I think...

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I'm with you. I think we're very much getting there. You know, it's interesting because big pharma it is it's a five point what five point one trillion dollar hedge fund basically and I recently done an episode just a couple episodes ago here about the sort of the rise and fall of Western medicine and we actually know back in the 1860s we were still using natural medicine right into the Civil War and Dr. Francis Porsche if you recall him actually wrote a book called resources of the southern fields and forests which is all the natural herbs and plants.

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Sage Workinger (33:56.897)
Mmm.

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Josh (33:59.136)
that were native to southern states of the United States. And so they estimate or historians I say they estimate that the Civil War started in 1861 should have ended by about 1863 but it didn't end until 1865. They credit that two extra years or the doubling of the war to all the natural plants and medicines that they used from this book because the surgeon general said...

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Here's everything we need. They took the book, got all the resources to all the army encampments, and it helped fix gangrene and infections and all kinds of stuff. But in 1870, after John D. Rockefeller founded Standard Oil, and now we start going into the...

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Sage Workinger (34:31.071)
Bye.

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Sage Workinger (34:35.346)
Yes.

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Josh (34:38.636)
the Flexner report where they went across the states and started basically destroying all of Western medicine, which used to be herbally naturally based. And here we are. And so it is a big financial thing. And so, like I said, my hairline's here because my tinfoil hat keeps rubbing it back, but this is all, it's documented.

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Sage Workinger (34:53.983)
I know, but the conspiracy theorists have been right a lot lately. I'm like, check, check, check. I want to like pat myself on the back. I know, but.

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Josh (34:59.339)
It has been and there was. I hate it. I know I hate being right because now I can't gloat about it either because I look like a dick. But so so we're on the same page. I mean, the world is so backwards on what we recommend. And I describe it this way. It's like your body is inflamed. It's a sign. It's screaming for help. It's like having a hostage in your living room. But instead, you put tape over their mouth and we go, look, we stopped it from screaming. So it must be better.

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Sage Workinger (35:08.863)
I know.

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Josh (35:29.322)
but they're still not happy to be there. And that's really what your body's going through. And so these genes that you're talking about are really at the root of a lot of our ability to just basically maintain our body's own homeostasis. If we can't even do that, we can't possibly get healthy. So talk to me about these. Talk to me about MTR and MTRR. These are two genes you mentioned as the five actionable genes. And I believe you said both of those were gut related or was it just MTRR? good.

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Sage Workinger (35:53.305)
Yes. No, both, both MTR and MTR. So it starts at MTHFR. And again, that can be mind and gut related. So with MTHFR, that's where we see anxiety, anxiousness, depression, panic attacks, and worst cases, suicidal thoughts, all of which were happening to me. And then we also see lower gut symptoms there. So sometimes like in my case, I have a red MTHFR. So I got the mutation from both parents.

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And then I have a green MTR gene, which I didn't get either mutation from either parent. However, again, it's a sandbag pass. So my first one is operating at best zero to 10%. There's no way for the next one up the chain to work properly. So when I eat, take, you know, let's say I eat a bagel or I have the wrong type of pasta or rice or, you know, cookies. If it has folic acid in it, then I immediately bloat.

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I immediately get lower gut symptoms. And again, it can range, it can be gas, diarrhea, bloating, constipation. And what it is, is it's, it's, methylation helps the gut motility. So if you're in balance with your methylation, then your gut motility is working and functioning the right way. But if it's not, that's where it gets stopped up or it goes too far. And, and that's where those issues are. A lot of times people think they have a food intolerance because of this gene or again, MTR.

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Josh (36:51.976)
Mm.

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Josh (37:19.975)
Hmm.

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Sage Workinger (37:21.594)
And it really isn't that they, okay, for instance, people who in the US think they have to be gluten intolerant, they're like, I can't have bread, so I must have a gluten intolerance. But if they go to Italy or they go to France and they have a big old baguette or a whole bowl of pasta, they're fine and they can eat it. And they go, God, I'm so crazy that I can eat it over there. Well, it's because Italy and France, they don't spray their grain source with folic acid like the US does.

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Josh (37:36.198)
Hmm.

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Josh (37:45.671)
Folic acid.

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Sage Workinger (37:47.993)
And if you look at when they started, when the US started spraying our grain source and it was like, there's a study that shows it. It's like 1993 ish. And I always think of that too, cause I'm an eighties baby. I ate frosted flakes, shredded wheat and all the things. And I was, I had Flintstone vitamins and I was fine. I was like, mom was like a crazy kid. She was like, no, you're totally fine. Like I didn't have issues. But when they started adding in folic acid and cyanocobalamin into our food source, that's when things started to skyrocket up. So if you look at it,

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Josh (38:04.486)
Hehehehe.

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Sage Workinger (38:18.2)
there was a really interesting chart, I'll try to find it for you so you can link it, but where it's like, okay, we're gonna start spraying our grain source. And it was literally like, okay, we're gonna start here in the farms in this section of the country. And then we're gonna move to this section and then we're gonna move into this section. And what follows is the trends of all the issues, like all of a sudden anxiety goes through the roof, depression goes through the roof. Think about like autism. I didn't grow up with.

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Josh (38:44.933)
Sage Workinger (38:45.942)
I know that's a whole nother ball game and that's, I don't, I can't speak fully and intelligently on that because I don't, that's outside my scope for sure. But we didn't grow up with kids that were autistic, that had peanut allergies, that had anxiety issues, depression issues. I mean, I can think of one friend who was depressed, one. And she stood out because that was like kind of something that didn't make sense to the rest of us. My -

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Josh (38:47.78)
I know.

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Sage Workinger (39:15.254)
child now, she's 16 years old, almost 16 years old. She's like, all my friends have anxiety, all my friends are depressed, all my friends have gut issues. And so she's always like, Tom, I need to get a cheek swab, which cracks me up. But it's true, like, you know, you teach your kids the right way to eat, and you give them the right raw materials, and these issues will calm down. Again, ADD, ADHD, that was not really a thing, you know? We didn't, because we didn't feed our kids crappy foods. So with the...

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Josh (39:21.38)
Mm -hmm.

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Josh (39:39.907)
Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (39:44.596)
I always tell people stay to the outside of the grocery store. Stay to the outside. Get away from the inside unless it's frozen organic vegetables. Those are good because that's like they're frozen at the time that they pick them. But that's the only time I tell people to go to the middle of the grocery store. Stay away from the box stuff as much as possible. Or go organic. Yeah, franken foods. Yeah. So if you go organic, if you go imported, that's sort of my advice with crackers and cookies and breads and things like that is either try to make your own.

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Josh (39:54.337)
Mm -hmm.

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Josh (39:59.778)
Yeah, we call them Franken foods. Organic. Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (40:14.164)
with a non -enriched flour, but not everybody has the time to make bread. So, you know, buy the types that are not, it'll say enriched or fortified. That's how you know it has folic acid in it. That's a huge crucial piece for people to know. Also, if you look at a product and it just says that there's added B12, but it doesn't say the form of B12, assume it's cyanocobalamin and stay away from it.

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because otherwise it will say, if they know they put the right form in there, it's expensive. So if they know that they put the right form, they will write it on there. It'll say methylcobalamin. No food source is gonna have hydroxycobalamin, but if you go get IV therapy, I always tell people, ask them what type of B12 they're putting in your IV bag and make sure that it's methylcobalamin or hydroxycobalamin. And here's a good note about gut stuff. So the one piece of advice I always tell people.

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If you have MTR or MTRR, it is crucial that you get in the right forms of a full suite of B vitamins, again, through a vitamin, like a multivitamin, or if you go and do IV therapy on a regular basis, get the full suite of B vitamins, plus the B12. Again, look for methylcobalamin or hydroxycobalamin. And then you need zinc and magnesium. And if you get it from one, the genetic mutation from one parent, you need less.

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of those items, then if you got it from both parents, then you need to double up. And there's, you know, it's finding that careful balance of the right amounts to get the gut in check. But I mean, I cannot tell you how many people I know that here's a funny story for you about gut stuff since I know that's big. I was at a wedding one time in Cabo and one of our patients came running up to me, gave me this huge big hug.

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Josh (41:59.326)
Hmm.

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Sage Workinger (42:07.889)
She was like, my God, you've saved my life. She's like, I am pooping every day now because of you. And I mean, the bartender was like, what kind of conversation did I just become a part of? And we laughed so hard, but she was like, no, seriously, like I thought that it was normal because it was normal in my whole family. I thought it was normal to only go to the bathroom once a week, maybe even once every two weeks. And that was just the norm for her. And she was 50 years old. And...

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Josh (42:13.212)
Hahaha.

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Sage Workinger (42:36.016)
Once she got on our protocol and was taking the right vitamins and had the right supplements and then took out the things in her diet, then she was going to the bathroom every single day. And she was like, you've literally changed my life. So I always laugh about that story, but I also know for people that deal with the same thing, you know, it does run in families because it's genetic. So, but if that's what all your family does, then it, you know, it makes sense that that's what you would do. And you, why would you look for help outside of that?

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Josh (42:56.475)
Yeah.

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Josh (43:05.722)
Totally. Yeah, I mean, it's your norm and it's all you know. And so it wouldn't make any sense to go looking for otherwise you go, well, it's just genetic, which I think is ironic given our last conversation. It's genetic. Everyone's got it. My so and so has it. My dad has it. My mom has it. Of course I have it. Like genetics, obviously, right? The saying is now quite popular that they load the gun lifestyle pulls the trigger and something else has to test and make that go. But I think the question has to be asked and it's sort of an answer, but I really want to hit this one.

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Sage Workinger (43:08.239)
Get you in one.

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Sage Workinger (43:28.527)
Yeah. Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (43:35.791)
Okay.

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Josh (43:35.801)
just from a different angle. You talked about growing up in the 80s.

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You didn't know anybody. You had one friend who was maybe depressed. There could have been life stuff. Who knows? We've never had these issues. They skyrocketed since the introduction of folic acid and artificial vitamins. So the question has to be asked, how have humans survived since the beginning of time without genetic testing and certain multivitamins and all these specialties? Is everything we need from natural vitamins? Can we still get it? Is our food source so tampered? It's impossible to get what we need. What does that look like in your opinion?

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Sage Workinger (44:06.445)
Yeah, I mean, Lord knows it would be better if we could grow our own food and go back to the old days and, you know, actually grow tomatoes that have all the right vitamins in it that you need. I read something about spinach, how it's like pointless to eat spinach because it does not have the right, you know, you're not getting the right nutrients from it at all. And that's why we, you know, I take my supplements every day. I think it...

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Also is the U S is just not, they're not in the business of keeping us well. Unfortunately, I think again, if you go to Italy or, other countries, even Russia just banned, what did they ban? They banned.

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having a blank spot, but they banned something that's like totally normal here in their food source. You can't, thank you. Yes, yes. And so I'm like, okay, why aren't we doing that here? But again, it all relates back. It's the, gosh, I'll probably get in trouble for saying this, but food and drug administration, food and drugs should not be in the same sentence. And yet we have an entire organization that makes all the decisions for every human in the US.

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Josh (44:55.319)
GMOs, they made an act of terrorism, yeah.

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Sage Workinger (45:19.402)
And it's all tied in, again, conspiracy theorists, but it is true. And so, yeah, I don't think that they're... Go ahead.

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Josh (45:25.013)
Well, the FDA was actually, sorry, lost you there. The FDA was actually purchased by John D. Rockefeller back in the early 1900s, shortly before forming the American Cancer Society in 1913. So it is all owned by the guy who scrubbed Western medicine of herbs and natural remedies. So it's not crazy, it's documented.

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Sage Workinger (45:32.809)
Crazy.

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Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (45:41.733)
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And if we could just get back to that, and honestly, you know, some people, you know, yell at me when I say this, but COVID, I think, is one of the best things that ever happened to us, because it woke a lot of people up. Now, it also terrified the hell out of a lot of people, and now they're, you know, forever ruined because they're anxious all the time. Guess what? You wouldn't be that anxious if you were taking the right diet and supplementation.

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Josh (46:08.084)
Mm -hmm.

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Sage Workinger (46:09.449)
But I think it woke us up to what is in our food? What are they trying to give to us? What was in those vaccines? And how can I boost my immune system naturally? How can I stay better and healthier naturally? Because most people never wanna go back to that what happened. Nobody ever wants to visit the hospital like what was happening during those days. And...

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Josh (46:36.85)
Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (46:37.351)
And that was a big, I mean, it was a big boost in business for us because it really woke people up. Like, if I get an IV on a regular basis, if I just take vitamin D3 and K2 to, you know, boost my immune system with zinc and vitamin C, my God, that's so crazy. But it, and honestly, we weren't doing it either. I mean, I was taking the wrong multivitamins leading up to COVID. And, but I learned a lot through all of that. So I definitely was very much educated through that whole process.

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Josh (47:07.73)
It really is sort of a sad reality that I have so much job security and so do you. As much as I love, I love running a business. I have a problem with authority. I don't like being told what to do. But on the same, Compte, probably, that sounds right. I got the symptoms. But on the other hand, it is, it's infinite job security that we have so many people getting sick. If you actually look from a business side, what do you need to run a business? You need a starving market.

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Sage Workinger (47:13.095)
Yes.

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Sage Workinger (47:18.599)
I'm so happy.

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Josh (47:34.321)
Right. There's a great analogy by Alex Hermosy says, if you go out, want to sell hot dogs or as a business professor, someone you want to sell hot dogs, what do you need? Well, is it a better bun? A better meat? Is it organic? Is it whatever? No, you need to be 12 AM outside of a ball game. When everyone's drunk, coming out, looking for food, it's a starving crowd. And so you need a growing market. You need a starving crowd. You need something sustainable. Health is all of those things. It's a growing market because people are getting sicker and my job security.

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is actually because so many people are putting tape over the mouth of the hostage rather than actually doing what it needs to make it comfortable and send it home. You know, we're not giving our body what it needs. So it's quite a, it's really sad. I wish it wasn't what it is. It's like, you don't laugh, you'll cry. Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (48:17.893)
Yeah, I agree. Yeah. I mean, I wish we didn't have so many people in need, but instead, here's an interesting stat. It took us three years. So again, we started this whole, as soon as we fixed my methylation, I was like, we got to shout this to the world. And that was a big piece of making that decision in 2021 to go corporate and...

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you know, try to bring on more people to try to get this message out to the world because we knew we couldn't do it by ourselves in one little tiny clinic in Naples, Florida. So, you know, so we corrected my methylation, but then it took about three years over the course of the next three years to sell 20 ,000 tests. That was a big deal for us. Very big deal. And I was like, God, we helped 20 ,000 people. Like that was mind blowing to me at the time. Then Gary went on Joe Rogan and.

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Josh (49:14.126)
Hehehe.

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Sage Workinger (49:14.914)
We had the Joe Rogan effect. Literally, I've never seen anything like it in my life. Like, thank you to Joe Rogan for helping us get the message out. But, you know, he talked a little bit about methylation and you could see how fascinated Joe was about it. And people, even he told us that he listened to the, he never relistens to his podcast and he listened to it like three more times, just so he could take notes on everything, because he was so fascinated by it. And I love people's enthusiasm about it because again,

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Josh (49:36.877)
Hmm.

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Sage Workinger (49:45.281)
Unless you don't have any of the symptoms that I'm talking about that I've suffered with, okay, maybe you have no interest in it, but even if you don't have it, your parents may, or your friend, or your spouse, or your coworker, or something, somebody around you has mental or gut issues. And so it becomes fascinating to go, well, could I solve that naturally before going to, I'm not saying that nobody should ever be on some sort of support pharmaceutical.

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But I am saying that a lot of times people maybe don't need to be, maybe they could do solve these things naturally if they just are honest with themselves and take a look at their diet. But anyway, so we went from 20 ,000 in three years to 20 ,000 tests a month for three, like the next three, four months. And we completely overwhelmed our system. We were not prepared for that in any.

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Josh (50:20.013)
Mm -hmm.

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Josh (50:33.709)
You

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Sage Workinger (50:42.847)
former fashion, we did not have the staff to support that. We didn't have the gene tests to support that. Like we went from one little gene company to like four and we still overwhelmed them. So it was a trying time for 10X Health, but now we've kind of caught up and we've gotten through it. And I'm like, just hold on everybody. Everybody got excited about it. But I love that.

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people once they got the protocol and they understood it and they've really made changes. I can't tell you how many people come up to us now and tell us that we've changed their lives. Just like the lady that ran up to me in Cabo. But now that happens at the airport and the grocery store. And like, I got, again, I've got my college roommate calling me going, my patient's father is like obsessed with you guys. And it's just, it's a cool thing. It's cool that we made healthy, being healthy cool. And I'm proud of that. And I'm -

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Josh (51:31.147)
You

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Josh (51:36.011)
Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (51:38.59)
And I love this space and I love other people that are speaking about it. And I'm like in full support of all of us that are like trying to get the message out there. So the more I can learn from you and like go and repeat it to someone else and vice versa, like the better the world will be.

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Josh (51:54.506)
Yeah, I love your passion for this stuff. You know, tell you a little story. We're working with a boy. He was five years old when we started. He's six now, just turned. And he actually had severe ulcerative colitis, 10 bowel movements a day. He had blood and mucus in his stool. And this little boy would walk around like limping around the house, couldn't go outside. He had so much pain, this little kid. And his doctor said, well, it's genetic. That's all it is. It's this autoimmune disease.

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Sage Workinger (52:08.893)
baby.

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Josh (52:21.032)
whether God plays favorites or whatever it is, there's nothing we can do. And he had this diagnosis of colitis. And we took a look. I said, okay, like let's run some tests. I just want to see. So we did a GI map on this kid. He was, I mean, he was pale in the face, gray, losing weight. I said, something doesn't add up. We did a stool sample to GI map, measured his gut bacteria, and it was all over the place. I said, okay, he's five.

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Sage Workinger (52:41.187)
Mm -hmm.

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Josh (52:43.08)
He's not going to Amsterdam and doing drugs. He's not going out and eating McDonald's. His parents are very healthy. So we have to look at the family. Okay, well, mom's got itchy, dry scalp, a little bit of brain fog. Dad's got asthma. He's got two younger sisters who all have cognitive behavioral issues, temper tantrums. And okay, this sounds like a house full of mold. Ran a test on him, did a urine test, 15 different strains of toxic mold in his body.

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Sage Workinger (52:45.563)
right.

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Sage Workinger (52:59.644)
Yeah. yes.

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Sage Workinger (53:06.491)
Josh (53:07.719)
And God bless his family right away. They up they moved out of the house. They rented a trailer lived in like everything they had to do to get him out of this environment. And things started getting better within days, which for kids happens for adults. It doesn't. But this is this is the reality we have where doctors go. Well, whatever they would have left this little boy limping around the house with all the pain he has and just said nothing we could. It's genetic. Here's here's a drug that puts tape over its mouth. And that's it. But what we were able to do was completely

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Sage Workinger (53:18.01)
Mm -hmm.

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Sage Workinger (53:29.146)
It just said it was genetic. Yeah.

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Sage Workinger (53:35.706)
Yeah.

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Josh (53:37.624)
flip turn this on its head and remove it from the system and his body can heal. Inflammation is never random. And so...

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Sage Workinger (53:44.761)
You know, it's interesting when I went my first, my freshman year in college, I went to Florida State, it's an old school and I lived in the oldest dorm. Even my aunt had lived there like decades before me. But it was also like the party school at the time. And I was so ill, so sick, and this is back in 96. I was so sick and I would.

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my mom was like, why are you probably partying too much? And I'm like, but I would come home and I'd be home for Thanksgiving or I'd be home for Christmas break or spring break. And I wouldn't be sick. And funny thing was, is I was probably partying more when I came home than I was when I was actually at school. And I would feel fine when I was home and I go back to school and I would get sick. And at the time, nobody talked about mold, nobody. And it wasn't until years later that I,

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connected all the dots when I learned about mold. And I was like, there was a hurricane. I mean, it for sure was infested with mold before I moved in. But then we had a hurricane there where they had taken off all the doors. There were 16 floors and they took all of the doors off of both hallways on either side. And then the hurricane hit and nobody sealed up all 16 floors. And so all.

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Josh (54:49.859)
no.

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Sage Workinger (55:07.478)
that we were doing slip and slide in the hallways. We literally put soap and water in the hallways and we were slip and sliding through the dorm hallways. I mean, it was a complete shisho. And I think about that, like, nobody thought that's not good. That's gonna stick around, right? And I was sick as a dog until I left and then I moved into a new place my sophomore year and then I was fine. I never got sick again. But...

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Josh (55:18.211)
Wow.

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Josh (55:23.746)
wild.

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Sage Workinger (55:35.22)
Mold is a big thing. We see a lot of mold with patients when they come in. Nobody has tested them for the symptoms, but after like a slew of different like unknown random symptoms that nobody's been able to solve, we're like, okay, where do you live? What's the scenario? Let's run a mold panel on you. And inevitably like 99 % of the time it's the freaking cause. One of the, we do have like a mold, you know, help package that our main medical director has put together. It's been super helpful to people.

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Another thing I always recommend people do is try to find a clinic in your area that has a HOCAT machine, H -O -C -A -T -T. And you'll actually really appreciate this. It pulls out heavy metal toxins, it pulls out mold toxins, it pulls out so much stuff. It's got like, it's a sauna, it's got red light therapy, it's got a PMF mat thing, but mostly it's ozone therapy. So you literally like,

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go up to your neck and you breathe in oxygen through this thing. You gotta have somebody put you in this pod and you do. It is, yeah. And it's like 30 minute treatments that you can do once or twice a week, depending on how bad it is. But there's all these different settings. I mean, there's settings for pain and for kidney function, kidney or liver issues. But a big one is definitely for mold. And anybody that I know that I can get to come, well, I have one in my master bedroom now.

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Josh (56:39.265)
It's like an iron lung.

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Sage Workinger (57:03.539)
which is hilarious because basically I live in a biohacking lab.

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Josh (57:07.521)
Some people have tanning beds, you have a whole cat machine.

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Sage Workinger (57:10.674)
I got a HoCat, yeah. And I'm very grateful for it, because it does make me, because it makes me feel better. I have back issues, so I get in and put the back pain setting on. But I'd very much recommend a HoCat treatment. And usually if you Google around in your area, you can find one. For parasites, another cool thing is I did a parasite cleanse. Symbiotica had, like, has a good parasite cleanse capsules. So I just took the whole thing of that.

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And then there is a frequency scanner, like this machine that can detect parasites. And then you can basically, I can't speak intelligently on this, but I do have connections to people that can, but they treat it by with frequency. And that may not make sense to anybody, but you and I, but it works like it totally works. And it's so incredible. Like you, and it's super safe and it's really easy to treat kids and.

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Josh (58:00.993)
I'm with you.

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Sage Workinger (58:09.456)
you know an elderly and and you can really like see on your scans it going away so we all have parasites it's just you know how many do you really want sticking around so

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Josh (58:16.769)
Look, yeah.

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Well, it's interesting you mentioned frequency because that's something that was actually scrubbed from the textbooks back in the late 1800s as well.

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Sage Workinger (58:26.416)
Of course. Of course.

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Josh (58:26.977)
because they were using that. And there's even Ted talks about using sound frequency to shatter cancer cells, like the fat lady of the opera shattering a glass. And it's really amazing stuff. And so I believe it. Everything vibrates, has a frequency. We can see it in water. IKEA did a commercial about sound frequencies bullying a plant under the same conditions as encouraging and praising a plant one grew and died. We see it with rice. Did you?

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Sage Workinger (58:32.962)
Mm -hmm.

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I've seen that, yeah. Yep.

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Sage Workinger (58:50.063)
I did that in middle school. That was my science fair project. I had three basil plants and one was, you know, obviously the control one. So it had no music. I had one with classical music. And then I had one with heavy metal music and the classical grew the tallest. The heavy metal one almost nearly died. And that was my science fair project. I almost won state actually with that, but I didn't win. Yeah, nerds for life. Isn't that fun?

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Josh (59:13.596)
Hmm nerds for life Yeah, I did a fourth grade project on plant magnetism on or a magnetism on the growth speed the growth rate of plants and I made a hypothesis fourth grade about using Magnetism to actually help heal wounds bones and joints to draw minerals to the areas. Yeah nerd forever I Got one question for I want to wrap up here with you sage just I know you got to go pick up your kids Want to respect your time?

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Sage Workinger (59:32.397)
I love it. Dude, we're total nerds. I love it.

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Sage Workinger (59:40.621)
I know that we didn't talk about MTRR. Did you want to talk about that or you want to ask that question first?

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Josh (59:44.571)
I was, yeah, actually what I was gonna ask you is, is there a way, I wanted to go to MTR, MTRR, but symptomatically, if someone goes, well, I don't have a couple hundred bucks for a test, how can I check my symptoms? Because this is what we do for Crohn's colitis, 99 % of it's symptomatology, we've got it down to a freaking science. So how can they know if they got these genetic issues?

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Sage Workinger (59:54.989)
Absolutely.

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Sage Workinger (59:58.509)
Mm -hmm.

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Sage Workinger (01:00:04.749)
Okay, so again, just to repeat, so MTHFR, if you have any form of anxiety, which I differentiate anxiety from anxiousness, as in anxiety is a fear of the future and worrying about things that haven't happened yet, and may never happen, but we worry about them anyways. I have that. Or anxiousness is more of like, I'm impatient, I don't like to stand in line, they tap their feet. So anxiety, anxiousness, then some people have both.

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genetic breaks and they are just worried all the freaking time. And then there's, you know, if you have symptoms of depression, if you're having regular panic attacks, suicidal thoughts, and then lower gut symptoms, then that's MTH, that can be all MTHFR related. And that's where you wanna get folic acid out of your diet and you wanna add in five -methylfolate. So there are ways to get in the five, you know, the folate through diet.

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if you can't supplement, but obviously supplementation is always easier. But there are natural ways to, you know, more leafy greens and, you know, legumes and things like that. Then MTR is gonna be your gas, diarrhea, bloating, constipation. And MTRR is gonna be more acid reflux, heartburn symptoms. And those things, we always tell people like, you wanna focus on the full suite of B vitamins.

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the right form of B12, a natural form of B12, so methylcobalamin, hydroxycobalamin, or adenosylcobalamin. Have to, have to, have to avoid cyanocobalamin, C -Y -A -N -O -C -O -B -A -L -A -I -N, I think. Avoid it like the plague. Yes, thank you. Avoid that like the plague. And...

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Josh (01:01:46.619)
You spelled the best word. You win the trophy for the spelling bee.

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Sage Workinger (01:01:54.189)
and then add in the right form of zinc and magnesium. And sometimes, you know, you have to play with magnesium. Some people do better on different types of magnesium. And then some people do better with it in the morning. Some people do better with it at night. So you can play with the type in the form of magnesium. But so, sweet B vitamins, B, right form of B12, zinc and magnesium will help correct those things.

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And then if you have AHCY, that's again, that's more of kind of the addiction piece, the dopamine serotonin level piece. TMG is a really, trimethylglycine is a really good supplement that also can help correct kind of that MTRR. The idea with TMG and glutathione, that's a big one too, which is like the mother of all antioxidants.

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that really can help lower homocysteine levels. And that's super crucial in methylation is you wanna lower, the goal is to lower homocysteine. So if you go to your doctor and you get a blood test, ask for homocysteine to be pulled, most doctors will think you're crazy, but that's a really important one that will show you if you have methylation issues and it might be a cheaper way to figure it out. And then the COMT, the C -O -T, that is,

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You want to avoid, again, you want all the vitamins I just listed, but you want to avoid green tea, avoid quercetin. Quercetin and elderberry got very popular during COVID because they were like, it's great for to boost your immune system. Green tea is a beautiful drink to drink as long as you don't have a comp tea break. If you have a comp tea break, forget about it. If I drink green tea, I will spin out and have a panic attack. If I have quercetin, which...

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There's high levels of quercetin in elderberry and capers. But again, a lot of people were like just feeding their kids elderberry gummies and elderberry tea like it was going out of style. And that's actually terrible for kids. So if your kids are spinning out, if your mind is racing, if there's poor sleep, you know, you have a hard time falling asleep or you're waking up in the middle of the night and you can't get back to sleep. Those are all symptoms of comp tea. So.

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Sage Workinger (01:04:11.597)
Again, all of the right, a good multivitamin, which 10X, we make a, Gary actually helped create and put together a multivitamin based on those five basic genetics. And again, you could take 10X Optimize and there's, you know, one to three capsules depending on your weight and your size and your age, really. But otherwise, if you have kids, you know, look for a good, like type organic,

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multivitamin and you know again with all the right no synthetic versions. Also people have to be aware that a lot of times on multivitamin it will say folate and in parentheses it'll say as folic acid or it'll say like a percentage is folate and a percentage is folic acid. You still have to avoid it if you have MTHFR. So that's another important thing. So I always just tell people like don't eat fast food.

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Look out for, you know, try as best as possible to go organic or imported and, you know, stay on the outside of the grocery store. You'll feel better. People know if they're eating fast food all the time and then they don't eat fast food or they stop eating seed oils. I cannot eat seed oils. That doesn't even have to do with methylation. That is just, my gut will be a disaster if I have seed oils. And so there's an app. Have you ever heard of the Seed Oil Scout?

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Josh (01:05:26.382)
Mmm.

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Josh (01:05:38.798)
No, it sounds great.

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Sage Workinger (01:05:40.574)
Seed oil scout, they're growing. Every time I go to a city, I can find more and more restaurants that don't use seed oils. So you type in your zip code and then it'll tell you in your zip code area what restaurants are not using seed oils or that you can at least just ask them to cook with just butter instead of oils. But I notice all the time when I'm, I'll stay at home for 30 days and I just love, love, love to cook because you can see my parents love, they have a beautiful kitchen and I just grew up.

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being fed really awesome food. So I love to cook at home with healthy, organic, you know, no seed oil products. And then when I go and travel and I have no choice but to eat out at restaurants, immediately like, my stomach is killing me. So that's a big thing too, if people have gut issues, but hopefully that kind of helps. my gosh, look at that cutie. Hi.

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Josh (01:06:27.66)
Mm -hmm.

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Josh (01:06:36.264)
This is Bruce. He was it's almost dinner time. He's at my leg like scratching my leg. Well, I have been blown away. I always get excited. We have great guests. I'm actually really excited in a couple of months. We actually have Bruce Lipton coming on if you know, yeah, biology of belief. So very excited. We get like celebrities on.

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Sage Workinger (01:06:41.084)
He's like, hello, yeah, it's time. Tell this lady to shut up.

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Sage Workinger (01:06:48.476)
Yay!

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Sage Workinger (01:06:57.34)
Yes, Gary loves Bruce Lipton. He nerds out about him all the time.

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Josh (01:07:01.674)
yeah, I love it. I'm just super excited to have him on doing this show. I do geek out with my guests again. I have like a collector like every time I have someone I make a new image. I'm like, yes, they're mine now. So thrilled to have it. But this one, I wasn't sure what to expect. I've been really digging your content. I've been following along and I thought she's going to have something interesting to say. I'll tell you Sage. I have just been blown away. I have notes on notes I've taken on my sticky notes.

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Sage Workinger (01:07:13.116)
hahahaha

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Sage Workinger (01:07:24.122)
Yay!

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Thank you. I love it.

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Josh (01:07:31.274)
Yeah, thank you so much for being here, for doing this, for just, you know, jumping in and being so eager to be on the show. I have to ask.

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Sage Workinger (01:07:38.17)
And let me know what kind of content you want me to like, I think if I got encouraging messages like, hey, I want to know about this, like go back to the grocery store and tell me what I should or shouldn't be eating. Like the grocery store videos got a lot of, they went viral. So I need to do some more of those. But yeah, so feel free to ask me, tell me what you want to hear more of.

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Josh (01:07:53.928)
Yeah.

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100 % I'll see if my listeners write in if you guys are listening now do write into the show There will be a link in the notes as well anything you want to hear more of see more of but I think the biggest question We're gonna have Sage's. How do we hear more from you? How do we find you work with you? What's the options here?

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Sage Workinger (01:08:01.401)
yeah.

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Sage Workinger (01:08:12.505)
Yes. So you can, I'm better at Instagram than anything else. So you can find me on Instagram at Sage, S -A -G -E working or W -O -R -K -I -N -G -E -R. And then from there, I have a LinkedIn section that has links to other podcasts I've done. Other, it has a link to the genetic test that I was talking about with Senex Health and,

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you know, and if you want any information about 10X Health, you can always send me a DM on Instagram. I'm pretty good about getting back to people. And you can also go to at 10X Health System. And 10XHealthSystem .com is a good website to get more information. But yeah, the gene test link is, I think it's 10XGeneTest .com, but it's on my LinkedIn thing on Instagram. So that's kind of the best way. And I'm gonna just.

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I am gonna start posting some more and I got a guy, I got a guy who is going to do better at like posting my things on other platforms. TikTok was gonna be one of them, but that might go away, so I don't know.

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Josh (01:09:10.054)
Okay.

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Josh (01:09:19.718)
Yeah, we don't know. Yeah, it's funny. The guy who actually wrote the bill to ban TikTok just bought $700 ,000 worth of meta Facebook stock. So really interesting. Yeah, what a country.

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Sage Workinger (01:09:26.902)
yeah, that'll be interesting to see. And then the other thing too that I recommend, if you're a big Gary Brekka fan or if you've never heard of Gary Brekka, then definitely go to theultimatehuman .com and check out on Spotify or Apple or wherever you listen to your podcasts, I've got my t -shirt on, The Ultimate Human. And we try to put really cool guests on there. Some of them are patients of ours that have had a life -changing experience.

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Some are scientists and doctors and people that Gary likes to nerd out with. So just trying to get more people and get this message out there. But yeah, we're trying to really encourage a good chemical -free, healthy living lifestyle.

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Josh (01:10:12.324)
Yeah, don't don't go listen to the ultimate human. I'll never see or hear from you guys again. I'll lose you guys forever. It is a great podcast. It's a great show. Yeah, very, very good. Well, I'll make sure so our listeners don't have to remember all those links. I'll drop them all in the show notes. Thank you again, Sage has been so fantastic to get to meet you to get to hear from you and learn from you and we appreciate you being here and sharing your expertise.

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Sage Workinger (01:10:17.454)
yeah, that's a good one. Thank you.

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Sage Workinger (01:10:26.166)
Thank you.

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Sage Workinger (01:10:30.102)
Thanks.

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Sage Workinger (01:10:34.198)
Thank you. I appreciate you having me on.